Why even join a KQ

[maestromindtake]

Why even join a KQ if you're going to sit there and leech it gets old and I'm sick of it...

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll84/Maestromind/leecher.jpg

[DF001]

So you can get exp without doing anything? o.o

PS: Retorical question, and no comma after the ''so''.

[willemstyle]

they should make a small afk detection, and players staying more then 10% of the game afk will not gain rewards at the end

[Jsonthegreat]

So you can get exp without doing anything? o.o

Yeah I think if whoever is leeching is in a pt. Spidey kq sucks anyway though..

[DF001]

they should make a small afk detection, and players staying more then 10% of the game afk will not gain rewards at the end

So if I do my best for 27 minutes and then I have to afk for 3 minutes, I shouldn't get the reward?

[Miazma]

So if I do my best for 27 minutes and then I have to afk for 3 minutes, I shouldn't get the reward?

On the rare occassion *nature* calls during a KQ I will click on follow on a party member while we are running to the next spawn point. Apart from that I wouldnt ever inconvenience a party by going afk.

KKQ has a huge leeching population and like many I find it very annoying. A few simple things could be put in place to stop it but the game makers just dont choose to do it.

2 minutes after the start of a KKQ a large mob should be spawned in the spawn point area. This would kill all the leechers who choose to enter the KKQ and then instantly go AFK.

For the leechers who simply run through the KKQ to get to the boss spawn point without killing all the mini bosses. If all the maps had mobs on them and the death of the mini boss *cleared* the map to the next spawn point this would stop them.

[willemstyle]

On the rare occassion *nature* calls during a KQ I will click on follow on a party member while we are running to the next spawn point. Apart from that I wouldnt ever inconvenience a party by going afk.

KKQ has a huge leeching population and like many I find it very annoying. A few simple things could be put in place to stop it but the game makers just dont choose to do it.

2 minutes after the start of a KKQ a large mob should be spawned in the spawn point area. This would kill all the leechers who choose to enter the KKQ and then instantly go AFK.

For the leechers who simply run through the KKQ to get to the boss spawn point without killing all the mini bosses. If all the maps had mobs on them and the death of the mini boss *cleared* the map to the next spawn point this would stop them.


These two bold made things i like very much! And i would like to add more things:

Let there spawn some monsters, patrolling the KQ and searching for players every time. This will get the leechers nowhere.

[PaZKarL]

I have seen leecher in spidey and KKP... they do it for the reward. KKP KQ is the most easy to leech, just pretend to afk for a while at the starting point, then wait for other people leave u behind, then.. wait till success.

I know that, because I always slow on loading screen and always left behind. Sometimes I see the same person for a few KQ...

[maestromindtake]

I like the direction this thread is going those are some really good anti-leeching ideas

[devilia]

2 minutes after the start of a KKQ a large mob should be spawned in the spawn point area. This would kill all the leechers who choose to enter the KKQ and then instantly go AFK.

For the leechers who simply run through the KKQ to get to the boss spawn point without killing all the mini bosses. If all the maps had mobs on them and the death of the mini boss *cleared* the map to the next spawn point this would stop them.

The 2min idea can easily be countered by following another person which is participating in the kq and then going afk^^. like wise for the second part, instead of going ahead to the next area follow non tanks like archers, and mages^^.

[Jsonthegreat]

I like the direction this thread is going those are some really good anti-leeching ideas

Dont you complain in every kq though? Even pvp ones?

[pacman33]

lol what if an archer is tanking? (I know, i only mentioned archers cuz u know...ima mage too btw xD)

[YoshimaruOrona]

For king slime, mara, honeying, MD, and KKP kq's:

Have an insane number of monsters spawn at the beginning of the map after about 10 or 15 minutes of play. Anybody who's afk-leeching will be dead, no doubt.

For the leechers who are on follow, have the server automatically disconnect them after 15 minutes of inactivity. Most kq's are 30 minutes long or less, so if you're not doing anything for half of that time, then you don't deserve a thing. (Also, I realize that some leechers think follow makes them safe, but people need to understand that a simple relog will break whatever follow the leecher has on you.)



For robo and spider KQ's:

Occassionally (as in every 3-4 minutes) spawn a few monsters in that far back corner in the room where people like to afk. That'll take care of the afk leechers. This might not always work for spider kq though due to the fact that you're given 7 hearts in that kq.

And like with the other, if they're inactive for 10-15 minutes, they get disconnected from the server. Very simple.

(Note: I didn't address GM kq because I haven't done it in a while and can't remember the kq's layout.)

I'm sure there's ways around anti-leeching methods, but even so, it'll at least make it obvious that someone is leeching, rather than possibly hiding behind the "I'm busy with something irl" excuse. Also, it'd definitely require more work to leech if there's some anti-leeching detection in place.

[obson90]

Dont you complain in every kq though? Even pvp ones?

o.O .....ok so leeching is bad almost always but i have to agree in the pvp kq area.
i love it when ppl leech it ...FREE POINTS :D

[whatever1234567]

You can't disconnect people who afk for more then 15 minutes because that would destroy afk shopping >> and i really don't think they could make it just in KQs

[Jsonthegreat]

o.O .....ok so leeching is bad almost always but i have to agree in the pvp kq area.
i love it when ppl leech it ...FREE POINTS :D

Yeah, I agree. But its not leeching that i'm talking about in pvp, its the thread owner always complaining in every single kq about something or another. Heres a post I made and I mentioned him on 2nd page just as the guy who always complains in pvp kq's even before this post was made.

http://outspark.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148563

[maestromindtake]

wow you're reduced to flaming yet again for your own satisfaction.... I started this post to address and open up discussion about an issue we all have to deal with on an almost everyday basis......

Seriously if you have nothing important to add to the conversation keep it to yourself

[rosaleifs]

leeching isn't kewl...believe me, i've been a witness to a lot of people doing it, i tried to get the poor pt who has those stupid people out..i'm serious, kq's are kinda annoying regardless..no need for leechers to make it twice as hard and irritating :P

[undefined]

"For the leechers who are on follow, have the server automatically disconnect them after 15 minutes of inactivity."

Yes. <3

[Jsonthegreat]

wow you're reduced to flaming yet again for your own satisfaction.... I started this post to address and open up discussion about an issue we all have to deal with on an almost everyday basis......

Seriously if you have nothing important to add to the conversation keep it to yourself

Leeching is wrong. I've never done it and I never will... but you have to admit you have something new to complain about every kq... whether it be teaming or leechers or even the color of sum1's hair... you find a way to complain.

[12markkram34]

Good ideas, but they probably won't make it into the game. Leeching is not something Outspark is interested in fixing. Cash shop is what they are interested in.

[jane_sama]

Good ideas, but they probably won't make it into the game. Leeching is not something Outspark is interested in fixing. Cash shop is what they are interested in.

Second that.

It would be great if the did something about it tho.The leechers that come on of mushie on the last second just to get the kill are the most annoying ones >.<
They just sit there and watch us suffer >.<

[elisagiven]

One thing we have started doing in KKP at the end if they afk is traing them with mobs, hopefully it kills them and dont let the clerics rev either...if they arent in a party it will fix em. One day I will have the guts to train everyone at the beginning.
But still It hurts when you dont have enuf ppl to run the KQ and have so many leechers taking up space , paleeze just to make their scrolls or pots...gimme a break i want my mats too DX< A Blue would be nice but ....

[YoshimaruOrona]

You can't disconnect people who afk for more then 15 minutes because that would destroy afk shopping >> and i really don't think they could make it just in KQs

I didn't mean for that rule to apply on all maps. Just the ones where you go for kq's. It shouldn't be too difficult to make that possible. Just have that rule apply to all the maps without gates.

There's no kingdom quest map with a gate.

And there's no regular map (hunting or town-related) that exists with zero gates. If so, then nobody is on it ;P

[cercia]

There's no kingdom quest map with a gate.

Gold Hill.

[viorexx]

there is a gate like thing in golden hill. they should have more gate in the kq. kill a mini boss. one gate opens the other closes. the player on the other side of the will have a ton of mob on them. to stop following they should disable follow in kq.
but there will be those that will just follow and do nothing.
then let make it so that you only get a reword only if you are in a party.

[cercia]

then let make it so that you only get a reword only if you are in a party.

And then, that 16th person in Robo KQ gets gypped.
That 11th person in most other KQs also gets gypped.
Edit: Also, who's to stop people from parting with people outside of the KQ so they are "in party?"

I've been in a successful 6 person KQ, soloing, because the other party was pre-formed and no one else joined.

I like your mini-boss gate idea better. Not quite sure how it would work for Robo/Spider, though.

Follow I use in case I need to briefly tend to something out of game (like two of my critters fighting amongst themselves), and then come right back.

As simple as the final solution will inevitably seem, it will be difficult to get there.

[jane_sama]

Just spawning a ton of mob after each mini boss is dead wouldn't do any good.Because people dc a lot.And catching up is already hard enough.

[AParadiseLost]

The gate idea is a good one. Just have gates through check points in the KQ. Cuts down on load and leechers.

[zephyr_wind]

Somewhat off topic but I really don't understand why people leech. If you have a good number of leechers in a KQ it's doomed to fail thus you really don't get the experience you were hoping to leech off of. Of course, I've only been in one or two where people where leeching. Once in MD I was the last one left cuz everyone else had died and I remembered a leecher, so I just led MD all the way to him and we both died. =P

[gshock2005]

Introduce the new command called 'anti follow' :)

Just leave the guy with the mobs if he just follow you.

[viorexx]

I like your mini-boss gate idea better. Not quite sure how it would work for Robo/Spider, though.

good point. most of the time in spider or robo the leacher just sit in the back in there house or just standing around.
i say program the mob to go after those in there house ignoring mock. for those that stand around if they dont attack something they are automatically killed at the end with no reword.

another way is let the players in the kq block the leacher from getting a reword and if the same player get blocked so many time then they are not able to enter a kq for a a really long time.

i know blocking someone from getting the reword can be abused. but there needs to be something to prevent leaching.

[cercia]

Somewhat off topic but I really don't understand why people leech. If you have a good number of leechers in a KQ it's doomed to fail thus you really don't get the experience you were hoping to leech off of. Of course, I've only been in one or two where people where leeching.

KKP needs only five people to be a success (could probably be done with only four). As such, the only KQ I know of that cannot succeed with any number of leechers greater than 2 is Honeying (and due to high fail rate and little xp return, they don't tend to join). King Slime can be soloed, Mara can be soloed, GH can be done with a small party (if lucky and efficient), Robo can be soloed, MD can be done with a party of five (HC not so much, but I don't know many leechers who go to HC due to higher fail rate), Spider can be soloed (same as Robo), KKP can be done as mentioned. No idea about Gordon; not there yet.

As you probably know, the real "problem leechers" tend to be in KKP, hence the appeal of the "mini-gates."

Edit:
for those that stand around if they dont attack something they are automatically killed at the end with no reword.

My concern with this is that it makes the KQ very unappealing to clerics, and is also easy to circumvent with any class but clerics. And programming so many exceptions in would make the game have to process more for little return, which is unappealing to the programmers.

As is, my cleric sometimes winds up doing very little because the other cleric is so fast, or because my party is mostly clerics (though I usually start attacking at that point).

[Kyo_Sama]

forget the afk manager, i want my rep system. dont have a high enough rep that week no KQ's for you.

Rep can be gained by, completion of quest and KQ's
Rep can be removed by Players neg rep'ing you in KQ's for Leeching

so simply the - value is alot higher than the + so that its not easy to gain rep back once you been reported for Leeching.

[cercia]

That would certainly make "good job" a lot less hollow.

[DF001]

forget the afk manager, i want my rep system. dont have a high enough rep that week no KQ's for you.

Rep can be gained by, completion of quest and KQ's
Rep can be removed by Players neg rep'ing you in KQ's for Leeching

so simply the - value is alot higher than the + so that its not easy to gain rep back once you been reported for Leeching.

Can easily be abused.

[YoshimaruOrona]

Gold Hill.

Good catch.

But the gates there (and there are a few in Gordon kq too) aren't warp gates, they're more like doors. There's a difference between the two, and the programming should know that.

Gold hill has that one warp gate thing at the end that you have to click to leave which is extremely pointless and can probably be removed without any downside imo.

The minigates is going to be a problem for anybody who needs to afk for a short while (bathroom run, being told to take out the trash, etc.) and wants to catch up the group. Same thing applies if people dc. Are they just out of luck and knocked out of the kingdom quest?

And as far as robo and spider go, I already proposed having a small group of mobs (3-5) spawn in that back corner every 3-4 minutes, which will eliminate the afk leeches.

No rep system >> It was removed from the forums for several reasons, why would we possibly bring it back for in-game purposes?

[unwisemonkey]

I'm somewhat impartial to leechers... I don't care if they're there and I don't understand what all this fuss is about. Perhaps KQs change in the higher levels, but as I'm fairly new, I've only ever done king slime, mara and gold hill kqs.

In my experience of kqs, having less ppl reaching the completion of the kq does not increase the final exp for the survivors. I remember completing a mara kq, being one of the remaining 2, but I don't remember receiving any more exp than the 1900 that I normally get with completing with a full 15 (theoretically, I did the work of 7 ppl, so I should have gotten about 14k exp). If they choose to leech and we don't survive, they don't get the exp either. If we complete the kq, then I quite enjoyed the challenge, knowing we had one less hand than what we potentially could have. Of course, since my main is a cleric, I don't use as much scrolls, stones and potions as a tanker would, if we are to have an extended battle. In their case, I can understand their fustration since kqs have no monetary reimbursement. Leechers won't get exp on route to the boss since it is up to the group leader to identify the leechers and boot them.

On the other hand, I don't know the circumstances of the leecher. Some are actually sincere - there were 3 situations I would like to share:

1) Once, I entered a gold hill kq and was glitched - stuck in the gate. The screen was black and I could see nothing. I was booted from my party in the meanwhile. It took me ages to relog since the game kept glitching. By the time I was able to get back into the game, everyone was down to the 3rd level. I pulled my weight from that point onwards and was allowed to join another party. Should I have suicided because I was "leeching" the first half of the kq? I didn't think it was fair that I should kill myself just because the game glitched and screwed me over. My intention was sincere and, as soon as I was able, I pulled my weight like everyone else. Imagine if I finally got back into the game and found a pack of respawned mobs aimed to catch the leechers? My theoretical "leech" was not my fault, hence I should not get penalised.

2) As I mentioned, my main is a cleric. There was a mara quest I was in where one of the fighters in my group had low hp and no scrolls or buffs to supplement it. So he pulled his weight for all the normal mobs but when we got to mara and malone, he died by mara aoe in 1 hit. As a fighter, only melee skills were available - unlike clerics, we can hide behind a secondary role - so since he can't go near the boss, he was useless. He was a valued team member in other respects and only stayed away because I asked him not to join the boss fight since I was not able to heal another 2 fighters and rez him every 10 seconds. That didn't stop the rest of the KQers screaming abuse at him for standing there not helping. He suicided - sad, since the situation wasn't sell understood.

3) The case above happened to me, too. Since my main was a cleric, I was totally unprepared for how defenceless a full END tanker would be when I tried out that new character. It was for king slime kq and was accused of being a leecher because I was running away from a gold slime, after I realised I would be dead in 3 hits (the group healer was far away and I was soloing the slime). My group understood my situation, but that didn't start the entire KQ taunting me on the shout. Seriously, being on the receiving end of all that, is painful... I think we can leave the bullying out of Fiesta, especially when people are using words like "leecher" (or "noob") out of context. I believe I pulled my weight, regardless of my disadvantage. I didn't sit in the corner. I attacked though careful not to pull the aggro, and ran if I did. I attack the mobs who are attack my group members whilst their attention was busy elsewhere. I used up 2 hearts and nearly died a third time pulling the aggro off the mage onto myself. There wasn't a problem until the gold slimes, so why should I quit when I've pulled my weight up till then?

My conclusion is that the concept of "leecher" is overrated and it's topics like these that fuel the hatred for anyone who *might* fall under one of the self-defined definitions of leeching. Imagine a rep system that bars you from KQing just because the game glitched you as soon as you enter the KQ and the other KQers believed you were "leeching". That's definitely not fair and imo, should not be implemented.

Sorry for the long post, but someone needed to speak on behalf of those who can be considered leeching when they had no intention to do so.

[cercia]

The main issue with leechers that I have seen is in KKP. Due to the high rewards, there is the possibility to walk away with a decent amount of mats and a blue weapon. Most players at this point understand how to play their class, since it is a level 70-80 KQ. However, I have only been in one KKP (the one in which only five of us joined) in which we had no one stand around at the very start of the map. Most of the ones I enter have 2-3 leechers. The thing with this is that it becomes clear, very fast, that the people there are solely there for the ig money/mats, so while everyone else is expending time and effort, the leechers are forcing the group to take longer and make up for the leechers' lack of effort. As I pointed out in an earlier post, this is rarely an actual problem, more just an annoyance.

In regards to not fighting against a boss, Mara KQ is an exception; it is the only KQ in which the boss does not spawn "adds" (or add spawns, however you prefer). Due to these spawns, even those who can't stand up against the boss's aoes will find themselves useful, and such harassment will go away. Unless you're like one fighter I dealt with who decided to sit Robo out until the mass spawns near the 8 minute mark. I made sure to never rev him.

MiniDragon KQ is another KQ in which people can have issues with loading late, or getting DCed. If you fall behind, you are literally forced to stay behind until the MD, as the spawned mobs always appear in your area and behind you. Even on a cleric, it is nearly impossible to run through these mobs without burning a heart. While KKP is similar (with less random stranding, I've noticed), the mobs don't deal as much damage proportionally, and/or you're better equipped by then, so its possible if you time your stones/pots right. Not a walk in the park for non-clerics, but possible.


Re: YoshimaruOrona
Depends entirely on how they were set. They could easily be simple graphical copies that don't programmatically resemble gates at all. As I said, I haven't been in Gordon KQ, so am not sure of how that one works. The GH one, I agree. It seems pointless to require a few seconds to finish what is already a completed KQ.

A generic concern with gates that has recently occurred to me (due to a series of failed gate-walking attempts last night), is the increased time requirement on slower computers. On computer A, I can load a map in about 30 seconds. On computer B, it takes closer to a minute. While using gates would be a solution, on KQs like Honeying, where time is important, this might be costly.

[ahtai]

Every single skill use will use sp. So leacher will have zero sp consumption or very low sp consumption. Why not say something like sp consumption is below certain level 20% of time idle during KQ will automatically don't have award and exp to receive at the end.

[cercia]

My concern with the sp consumption is the unlucky person who jumps into a KQ from the map, with their sp depleted, then realizes - they have no stones. :eek: Oops....

Along those lines of inactivity, why not a simple timeout? If the character is completely inactive (follow counts as active - they were at least at the keyboard when the KQ started) for x% of the max time allowed on the KQ, why not simply boot them?

This has the side effect of requiring constant data transmission, which is costly in terms of bandwidth.

[kirb-style]

How about for those that stand at the start of the KQ to leech after x amount of time of being afk if they haven't helped kill or killed anything if the KQ is a success they get no exp no chest no nothing.

Another idea if your leeching is like the above poster said simply kick them... or better yet since you get three lives after X amount of time take away a heart... take another one away then if you get to the last one and your still not back warp them back to town that way people who say.. gotta take a numero 2 during a kq might just lose a heart or something I know every life counts but I dont think all the other 14 people in the KQ care about your bathroom schedule if it slows them down or makes them lose a value healer/tank/dps.

[amythyst1969]

its pretty bad when your in a party with a cleric..your a cleric and trying to fight and heal while the other one sits there and does nothing. ppl in party die. talk about leeching... yeah i agree completely there has to be a way of fixing it so it shows you have done some progress in a kq.

[truelegend]

This has the side effect of requiring constant data transmission, which is costly in terms of bandwidth.
No point... an extra *idle* player does not send much data to the other clients.
And talking about bandwidth costs... I bet that the whole mini-house store thing alone is wasting a nice part of the server's bandwidth already - causing extra costs and maybe lags as well. Keeping online people for stores is not a good idea IMHO :confused:

[jane_sama]

I bet that the whole mini-house store thing alone is wasting a nice part of the server's bandwidth already - causing extra costs and maybe lags as well. Keeping online people for stores is not a good idea IMHO :confused:

Would be great if we could just leave our items in a market place and log off.

[Chaola]

What about the archer that follow all the way to KKP, put themselves in a safe corner and auto-attack during the rest of the KQ ?

[devin_nicolai]

Never leeched. I always thought you had to be near the boss monster or in the area of it when the KQ successes to get your reward. But its the whole map :c

[ahtai]

My concern with the sp consumption is the unlucky person who jumps into a KQ from the map, with their sp depleted, then realizes - they have no stones. :eek: Oops....


Actually their SP still moves, saw those happen in slime kq the person do a quick shoom and continue attack. If the person don't shoom/attack and stand around, yes it is leaching.

I think after slime KQ most of us do have a stack of potion in our inventoy for the just in case situation.


How about for those that stand at the start of the KQ to leech after x amount of time of being afk if they haven't helped kill or killed anything if the KQ is a success they get no exp no chest no nothing.

You are forgeting there is 1 class don't killing anything but working hard for KQ by healing everyone else who kills. T-T

Never leeched. I always thought you had to be near the boss monster or in the area of it when the KQ successes to get your reward. But its the whole map :c

The system look at who joined and still alive to award, not location specific. I was strangled in spider once so I hang around the map for the second spider and having fun with 16 person spider KQ. My name is not in the second KQ list so I don't get the award again. However I do get exp from what my teamate kills.

[unwisemonkey]

What about the archer that follow all the way to KKP, put themselves in a safe corner and auto-attack during the rest of the KQ ?

I don't know about KKP, but imo I consider auto-attacking as still attacking. Ideally, if everyone isn't in so much of a rush to finish the KQ so that they can get to a later one in the same hour, we could all get through using minimal stones and potions (maximising the theoretical value of the rewards) - hence everyone should work together and stick to auto-attacking with a few skills. But everyone is so competitive, everyone wants to see their debuff on the boss, dps classes are running into boss aoe range, clerics are forced to heal and rev almost everyone in their party, not just their fighters.... The exp rewards are great, but I feel (in terms of stones potions) I'm running at a loss, every time I step into a KQ. Don't get me wrong, KQs are great - my entire friendlist is from my previous KQ parties (the good ones). But if everyone could just chill and take their time, then we won't even end up with tankers running out of sp and losing their aggro, or other classes stealing aggro from the tank and causing a mass execution of the support/dps areas.

I think the best idea so far is disconnecting idle connections and change the shop system such that you don't need to go afk for effective vending.

[adf1falken]

KKP needs only five people to be a success (could probably be done with only four). As such, the only KQ I know of that cannot succeed with any number of leechers greater than 2 is Honeying (and due to high fail rate and little xp return, they don't tend to join). King Slime can be soloed, Mara can be soloed, GH can be done with a small party (if lucky and efficient), Robo can be soloed, MD can be done with a party of five (HC not so much, but I don't know many leechers who go to HC due to higher fail rate), Spider can be soloed (same as Robo), KKP can be done as mentioned. No idea about Gordon; not there yet.

As you probably know, the real "problem leechers" tend to be in KKP, hence the appeal of the "mini-gates."

Edit:

My concern with this is that it makes the KQ very unappealing to clerics, and is also easy to circumvent with any class but clerics. And programming so many exceptions in would make the game have to process more for little return, which is unappealing to the programmers.

As is, my cleric sometimes winds up doing very little because the other cleric is so fast, or because my party is mostly clerics (though I usually start attacking at that point).

I soloed king slime once on a fighter and only got to the second tier and how do you figure that robo can be soloed w/ the massive amouont of mobs that would be on just u?(Same thing w/ spider)

[cercia]

I soloed king slime once on a fighter and only got to the second tier and how do you figure that robo can be soloed w/ the massive amouont of mobs that would be on just u?(Same thing w/ spider)

Because people have boasted about soloing Robo KQ. I suspect it involves t3 scrolls (speed and mag.def in particular), massive numbers of t3 potions, fully +9ed greens high in end, and many charms/extenders, and probably a t3-4 Endure.

Not the cheapest or easiest way to do the KQ, mind you, but apparently possible.

On Teva, we've even had boasts about an archer soloing the entirety of King Slime. Considering the success I had with a party of 3 archers and a fighter (no cleric), I believe it to be doable.


Regarding the issues at hand:
Auto-attacking is at least doing something, even if not much. The natural boss regeneration is slowed, if not outright negated.

The bandwidth I figured would be hit by the additional "how long has this person been idle" value.

A marketplace wherein you can sell items while offline would be worthwhile, but that's for another thread, and the Marketplace forums kinda handle that.

Tankers running out of sp is also not something I've had to deal with. Again, though, another thread.


Suggestion summary:
X amount of idle time = penalty (loss of heart, booting, mobs spawning?).
Gates on distance based KQs
SP variance detection

[Andromeda]

KKP KQ can still be soloed but the only way you will do that is if you are a DD Fighter using an Axe and loaded with an extender and 70% charms.

But without charms it only needs 3 people to succeed

2 fighters and a cleric

Both fighters using an axe Pure STR build preferably and spamming the Vitality skill throughout the bosses. When mobs spawn at KKP the other fighter mocks them drags them away and devastates them and returns to KKP and if any mobs follow back kill them.

[devilia]

KKP was soloed by a cleric on another thread >.>
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random post.... bored >.>

[wallmaster]

Okay really, who cares about leeching? Have you FAILed that many times because 1 or 2 people leeched in a KQ?

If they are just sitting at the beginning and waiting for success, yeah it sucks that they didn't help, but I'm sure there was a time when that person was hardcore into a KQ when someone else was leeching, so I have no problem with it.

Granted I understand you don't want it to happen ever, but I still join the robo Kq and just stand around (party-less) and use deva' every once in a while, I have no need to be in the KQ and am not going to go all out every time, or if a friend needed robo or honeying I get them there.

If you are letting one person ruin the game for you, during a KQ, you are missing out on a lot of fun then, because this game does rock.

side note: I have never soloed a KQ, but I have beat robo with 2 clerics.

[YoshimaruOrona]

KKP was soloed by a cleric on another thread >.>
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random post.... bored >.>

That cleric solo definitely happened, but KKP was made harder since then (it happened during the lv89 cap raise - Late June 08 I believe). KKP was given more HP or a higher def/m.def since then.

[ahtai]

I soloed king slime once on a fighter and only got to the second tier and how do you figure that robo can be soloed w/ the massive amouont of mobs that would be on just u?(Same thing w/ spider)

If you are cleric expecially supporting built with t3 scroll expecially t3 speed you can do it. Just run run and run while healing yourself.

[laady]

Because those people suck as players. I had someone do the same thing in the second King Slime KQ I joined on Apoline and it really irritated me. I was level 6 when I joined the first one and was very surprisingly partied by some very kind people who seemed to trust me despite my low level. We won and then some of us joined a second one. I think in the end, only 6 or 7 people showed up and by the second level, only five were left. >.<

By then, I was level 8 or 9 or so (Cleric) and I was with two Fighters and two Archers. Everyone but one of the Archers did an awesome job, especially the Fighter who kited King Slime down out of the ring so that the mini slimes would be left behind and everyone else could get them while he distracted the King.

After we got the King and all the minis, we had to finish off the monsters we'd left behind (Wow is that KQ glitched these days...) and she followed us the whooooolllee way around that freaking ring. She stood just far enough away that she didn't have to do anything but just close enough that she was getting exp. I kept yelling at her to help and every so often, she'd halfheartedly fire off a few shots without using any skills and then quickly fall behind again. I'd turn my camera around and there she'd be, the nub she was, standing there watching. I was trying my best to heal everyone and so I basically spent all my time staring at my party members' health bars and my eyes were so sore...it was frustrating to know she was getting exp just standing there comfortably. >.<

So now any time I see her in a KQ, I make it a point to avoid her. I haven't seen her in a while so maybe she quit but I'd still never give her a chance, I wouldn't trust someone like that to not run out on you when you need them.

Annnnyways, maybe some sort of system should be put in place that requires that you fight so much in a certain amount of time or you're considered idle?

[Lety23]

Ok, so answering the original question...
Why join a KQ if people are going to leech?

Not every KQ is filled with leeches. Also, when there is a leech, and you absolutely know it (this being that they don't have a party and didn't inform anyone that they intend on returning), that person is usually kicked out. As in, people let mobs go to them and kill them. It's not that hard to figure out who is a leecher and who isn't.

And to someone who asked, will you really fail a whole KQ wih one or two leechers? Yes. Everyone can help. Everyone should help; it just makes winning easier.

[Celtic_Princess]

Okay really, who cares about leeching? Have you FAILed that many times because 1 or 2 people leeched in a KQ?

If they are just sitting at the beginning and waiting for success, yeah it sucks that they didn't help, but I'm sure there was a time when that person was hardcore into a KQ when someone else was leeching, so I have no problem with it.

The question becomes why should those players be allowed to stay in the KQ and leech when the spot could have gone to players who would have participated and helped and perhaps even enhanced the fun of playing in a KQ? Also, when there are a large number of leechers it can make it harder in some of the more demanding KQs to get a success...which can cause problems for people who are trying for titles.

[cercia]

Okay really, who cares about leeching? Have you FAILed that many times because 1 or 2 people leeched in a KQ?

Myself, no. But here's the rub.

In Honeying, you get 10 people. Probably 7 of those people need to fully know what they're doing, and be equipped to do it, in order to instruct/drag the others through it.

There is very, very little room for bad sportsmanship there. You work with the people (like them or not), do your job to the best of your ability, or it fails. Even when you put forth your best effort, it can still fail.

In every other KQ, you get at least 5 more people. As has been mentioned, you can solo, or even small party, through most of them. Now that MD is harder (I swear, I've never failed it four times consecutively before - that jump range has gotten a lot bigger :( ), it too requires more from the players. I've also noticed that the mining rewards are up.

KKP, the problem KQ at hand, has had an increased difficulty, but, possibly due to the players' skills, real or imagined, leechers join to reap the benefits of others' work. Outspark has said, "afk at your own risk," so why should leeches get rewards for being afk? Its a policy contradiction, and an irritant to some players.

[Kyo_Sama]

Can easily be abused.

Like everything else in this game cant ?

i.e sparkcash, guildwarring etc...