View Full Version : call for an organized market system
wangfu85
07-03-2007, 03:42 PM
I am not trying to overwhelm the english Fiesta development team, but i think the idea of implimenting an organized market system would be nice. i think its a waste of time trying to move from each personal shop to personal shop looking for items i want, not to mention some shops might be located in other towns. I really like to see an auction system like the from WoW to be used in Fiesta. There can be an alternative solution to this is by putting up a list of all the shops available, which then will allow the user to buy or sell from anywhere.
jclavau
07-03-2007, 03:49 PM
That's called an auction house, and yes it would be a great idea, but most F2P that I know of have little shops opened by players like Fiesta and not an auction house/market place.
JimJimster
07-03-2007, 04:02 PM
we need to hav more space to put items in our shop,a verification pop-up when u right click to buy something(i bought a goddess wing for 10s by accedint)and maybe a shop list for the city your in so u no whos selling wat*
Keenan
07-03-2007, 04:55 PM
or we can have like a market a place where you only can shop like its a def map in all.
JimJimster
07-03-2007, 05:43 PM
that would be nice,they also need to pay more for wepons that are refined or hav liscenses at the npc shops*
blackhowl69
07-03-2007, 08:15 PM
the xtra slot for selling at personal shops can be gained as cash shop items -_-! yeah but would be nice to have auction house same as WOW
JimJimster
07-03-2007, 08:15 PM
oh u gotta be kidding me thats almost as sad as speedy slimes attacking everything*
blackhowl69
07-03-2007, 08:25 PM
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="100%">
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<td>*AND SO IS THE III &amp; IV BAG/STORAGE SLOTS </td>
</tr>
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<td>
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="774">
<tbody>
<tr valign="top">
<td width="252">
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="252">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_1.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_2.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_3.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td background="/images/imall/frame_4.gif">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif </td>
<td>
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="234">
<tbody>
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<td class="itemfr01" colspan="3" height="19" background="/images/imall/item_bg.gif"> Feather of griffon </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="iconfr" width="80">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/archives/imall/icon_s/12036.jpg
</td>
<td width="4">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
<td width="144" valign="center">
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="144">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td colspan="2" width="61">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/icon01.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2" align="right"> <span class="s11hn"><font color="#009744">Extensions system</font></span> </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/coin.gif
<font class="itemprice">1000 <font class="itemfr02">salts</font></font>?
Acquisition mileage: 100 MP </td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3"> <font color="#1557b9">As for feeling instant movement!</font>
<font color="#1557b9">1 days 3 days 15 days 30 days 60th, period of 5 types preparation!</font> </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="iconfr" colspan="3"> “[rikiyasutotaimu] of the item shine Sho's wing” is 10 minutes.
During use period, the effect continues.
You can choose use period from 5 types of 1 days 3 days 15 days 30 days 60 days.
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3" align="center"></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td background="/images/imall/frame_6.gif">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_7.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_8.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_9.gif</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td width="9">http://brking.hi5games.jp/imall/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td width="252">
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="252">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_1.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_2.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_3.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td background="/images/imall/frame_4.gif">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif </td>
<td>
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="234">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td class="itemfr01" colspan="3" height="19" background="/images/imall/item_bg.gif"> Bag of traveler </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="iconfr" width="80">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/archives/imall/icon_s/12040.jpg
</td>
<td width="4">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
<td width="144" valign="center">
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="144">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td colspan="2" width="61">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/icon01.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2" align="right"> <span class="s11hn"><font color="#009744">Extensions system</font></span> </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/coin.gif
<font class="itemprice">700 <font class="itemfr02">salts</font></font>?
Acquisition mileage: 70 MP </td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
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<tr>
<td colspan="3"> <font color="#1557b9">The bag which is convenient to the offering/accompanying of traveling!</font>
<font color="#1557b9">1 days 3 days 15 days 30 days 60th, period of 5 types preparation!</font> </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="iconfr" colspan="3"> [aitemuinbentori] which you can use increases one, the number of items which can be possessed 24 becomes many.
During use period, the effect continues.
You can choose use period from 5 types of 1 days 3 days 15 days 30 days 60 days.
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3" align="center"></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td background="/images/imall/frame_6.gif">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_7.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_8.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_9.gif</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td width="9">http://brking.hi5games.jp/imall/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td width="252">
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="252">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_1.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_2.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_3.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td background="/images/imall/frame_4.gif">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif </td>
<td>
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="234">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td class="itemfr01" colspan="3" height="19" background="/images/imall/item_bg.gif"> Bag of venture person </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="iconfr" width="80">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/archives/imall/icon_s/12042.jpg
</td>
<td width="4">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
<td width="144" valign="center">
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="144">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td colspan="2" width="61">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/icon01.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2" align="right"> <span class="s11hn"><font color="#009744">Extensions system</font></span> </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/coin.gif
<font class="itemprice">1200 <font class="itemfr02">salts</font></font>?
Acquisition mileage: 120 MP </td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3"> <font color="#1557b9">The warehouse it does not need at this one!?</font>
<font color="#1557b9">1 days 3 days 15 days 30 days 60th, period of 5 types preparation!</font> </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="iconfr" colspan="3"> [aitemuinbentori] everything which you can use be able to use, the number of items which can be possessed 48 becomes many.
During use period, the effect continues.
You can choose use period from 5 types of 1 days 3 days 15 days 30 days 60 days.
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="3" align="center"></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td background="/images/imall/frame_6.gif">
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_7.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_8.gif</td>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/frame_9.gif</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/line_purple.gif
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="774">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td class="iconfr" width="80">http://brking.hi5games.jp/archives/imall/icon_s/12048.jpg</td>
<td width="4">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td width="234" valign="middle">
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="234">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td width="61">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/icon01.gif</td>
<td align="right"><span class="s11hn"><font color="#009744">Extensions system</font></span></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="itemfr01" colspan="2" height="19" background="/images/imall/item_bg.gif">Sign of large trade</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/coin.gif
<font class="itemprice">500 <font class="itemfr02">salts</font></font>? </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2"></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td width="9" valign="middle" background="/images/imall/line01.gif">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td class="s12h130" width="441" valign="top"> ?Acquisition mileage: 50 MP
<font color="#1557b9">Private store more conveniently?!</font>
<font color="#1557b9">1 days 3 days 15 days 30 days 60th, period of 5 types preparation!</font>
<font color="#666666">Five the slot where you can use with the private store it is possible to increase.</font>
<font color="#666666">During use period, the effect continues.</font>
You can choose use period from 5 types of 1 days 3 days 15 days 30 days 60 days.
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/line_purple.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/title_osusume.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="774">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td class="iconfr" width="80">http://brking.hi5games.jp/archives/imall/icon_s/AddStorageBox02.jpg</td>
<td width="4">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td width="234" valign="middle">
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="234">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td width="61">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/icon03.gif</td>
<td align="right"><span class="s11hn"><font color="#009744">Extensions system</font></span></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="itemfr01" colspan="2" height="19" background="/images/imall/item_bg.gif">Big crate</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/coin.gif
<font class="itemprice">3850 <font class="itemfr02">salts</font></font>? </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2"></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td width="9" valign="middle" background="/images/imall/line01.gif">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td class="s12h130" width="441" valign="top"> ?Acquisition mileage: 385 MP
<font color="#1557b9">?Also the warehouse curator is surprised! ?15 days 30 days 60th, period of 3 types preparation!</font>
<font color="#666666">During use period, the page of the warehouse which can be used increases two.</font>
<font color="#666666">Use period can be selected from 3 types of 15 days 30 days 60 days.</font> </td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/line_purple.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/title_teiban.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="774">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td class="iconfr" width="80">http://brking.hi5games.jp/archives/imall/icon_s/ActiveFeathers01.jpg</td>
<td width="4">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td width="234" valign="middle">
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="234">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td width="61">*</td>
<td align="right"><span class="s11hn"><font color="#009744">Extensions system</font></span></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="itemfr01" colspan="2" height="19" background="/images/imall/item_bg.gif">Feather of hole sparrow</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/coin.gif
<font class="itemprice">1100 <font class="itemfr02">salts</font></font>? </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2"></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td width="9" valign="middle" background="/images/imall/line01.gif">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td class="s12h130" width="441" valign="top"> ?Acquisition mileage: 110 MP
<font color="#1557b9">?The shine Sho's wing easy to use! ?15 days 30 days 60th, period of 3 types preparation!</font>
<font color="#666666">During use period, [rikiyasutotaimu] of the “shine Sho's wing” is 30 minutes.</font>
<font color="#666666">Use period can be selected from 3 types of 15 days 30 days 60 days.</font> </td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/line_purple.gif
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="774">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td class="iconfr" width="80">http://brking.hi5games.jp/archives/imall/icon_s/ActiveFeathers02.jpg</td>
<td width="4">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td width="234" valign="middle">
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="234">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td width="61">*</td>
<td align="right"><span class="s11hn"><font color="#009744">Extensions system</font></span></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="itemfr01" colspan="2" height="19" background="/images/imall/item_bg.gif">Feather of ?</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/coin.gif
<font class="itemprice">1650 <font class="itemfr02">salts</font></font>? </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2"></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td width="9" valign="middle" background="/images/imall/line01.gif">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td class="s12h130" width="441" valign="top"> ?Acquisition mileage: 165 MP
<font color="#1557b9">?The shine Sho's wing furthermore easy to use! ?15 days 30 days 60th, period of 3 types preparation!</font>
<font color="#666666">During use period, [rikiyasutotaimu] of the “shine Sho's wing” is 20 minutes.</font>
<font color="#666666">Use period can be selected from 3 types of 15 days 30 days 60 days.</font> </td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/line_purple.gif
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="774">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td class="iconfr" width="80">http://brking.hi5games.jp/archives/imall/icon_s/AddStorageBox01.jpg</td>
<td width="4">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td width="234" valign="middle">
<table border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" width="234">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td width="61">*</td>
<td align="right"><span class="s11hn"><font color="#009744">Extensions system</font></span></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="itemfr01" colspan="2" height="19" background="/images/imall/item_bg.gif">Small crate</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/coin.gif
<font class="itemprice">2000 <font class="itemfr02">salts</font></font>? </td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td class="s12h130" colspan="2"></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
<td width="9" valign="middle" background="/images/imall/line01.gif">http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
<td class="s12h130" width="441" valign="top"> ?Acquisition mileage: 200 MP
<font color="#1557b9">?The warehouse will be expanded! ?15 days 30 days 60th, period of 3 types preparation!</font>
<font color="#666666">During use period, the page of the warehouse which can be used increases one.</font>
<font color="#666666">Use period can be selected from 3 types of 15 days 30 days 60 days.</font> </td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/imall/line_purple.gif
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>http://brking.hi5games.jp/images/common/spacer.gif</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
JimJimster
07-03-2007, 08:29 PM
omg guntrix plz be smart we dont want this junk, especially for real cash*
jala81
07-04-2007, 04:07 AM
wangfu85: While your sayings are true, I prefer wandering about looking at the various shops that have popped almost anywhere. An easy way would be to shout what you want to buy/sell and for the sake of avoiding spamming and/or overchatting(?), a Merchant Channel could be incorporated for those interested. Now, if one had opened a shop, with the items you so desperately need, and went afk as to not hear your shouts (or pleas), that's another story.
Keenan: not a bad idea ****hen... o.O;; I mean, but then, this place would be full of lag. Besides, Roumen and Elderine aren't so huge towns (especially Roumen, where the way is but a single road *winks*), so you can find what you want w/ little effort.
IMO, its the player shop that needs revising. It's kinda frustrating to close and open the shop again and again, just to change the shop's title or the items being sold. Maybe keep the store open while you update its content?
ral13
07-04-2007, 05:14 AM
I really don't want a auction house. I like the random shop placements.(Serious)
thesjaakie
07-04-2007, 05:37 AM
Auction houses can be nice so now and then. But I prefer random shops too. It shows more community. Community = fun.
So in other words, laziness is nice because everything goes smoothly. But admit that the game gets bored more quickly. Just like the teleport system that one guy named. It's nice to travel quickly, but it takes out the fun of the actualy game.
wangfu85
07-04-2007, 07:16 AM
<p class="MsoNormal">
Boredom was not within my objectives of trying to find ways
to clean up the game, simplifying the chaos in the merchant shopping experience
however was. I just thought that having an experience of finding random shops
scattered throughout town annoying, not to mention it was basically messy.
Auction itself could be a solution, but all I wish fiesta to be improved on is a
basic<span style="color: #999999"> </span><span style="color: black">accessible</span>
list of the shops available in town. Simple as that; it’s clean and shows all
the shops; no need to play hide and seek with stupid shop keepers.
<p class="MsoNormal">
Btw boredom is bound to strike anyone as long as they lose
interest. I don’t believe that by simplifying the merchant system can cause you
to lose interest to the point that you will throw in the towel.
thesjaakie
07-04-2007, 07:25 AM
wagnfu, let me ask you this. If you want to buy groceries or something. Would you rather buy them all online and let them order them to your home. Or, would you rather go to a market place with loads of stands?
I personally pick the market any time. It's kind of the same thing here.
But no I don't say you lose interest immediatly, of course not. But it does go quicker for most. Since, at least for me and I know for sure there are more, the game will then seem more static since everthing is just &quot;given&quot; to you. But the latter argument may be (even) more personal though.