PvP Battle Cleric

[ShinMegamiTensei]

That's my actual idea for a cleric build with PvP as only objective:

General stats:

2:1 STR/END (+40 STR ;+20 END)

Skill Enpowerment:

Heal : +5 sp consuption decrease; +5 cooldown decrease

Invincible: +5 duration time

Bash: +5 power; +5 cooldown decrease ; +4 sp consuption decrease

I prefer full enpowerment of bash instead of trip/bleed because it's not weapon-related.
Suggestions are welcome.

[Shahared]

You can only do a maximum of plus 10 points to a skill....you have plus 14 on bash....everything else looks ok to me, although I personally would increase endurance a bit more, suits my taste better.

[zendragon]

Clerics aren't designed for PvP. So naturally their dmg will be the lowest compared to the other classes. Because the only real damage clerics is Bash... and Trip/Bleed is still bugged, while fighters/archers/mages have multiple damage spells, you just can't compete. Try it in a friendly guild war though, the battle will just consist of you mostly doing self-heal because for every 1 Bash you do, a fighter can probably do 3-4 damage spells.

If you want a PvP character with lots of HP, do a fighter with some END.

[Amil5000]

na clerics pwn warriors and mages so archers cause theyre gonna waste all their mana and pots ,stones:p

[Stenbumling]

As stated, clerics are mainly for support. If you want to survive a guild war, put full END and heal yourself, you can use heal buff on other members in your guild.

Seeing how clerics have the lowest attack, your best option would be to tank the oppenent's attacks whilst waiting for your own archers/mages/fighters take them out. It's boring, but it works.

[ShinMegamiTensei]

Didn't know of the +10 limit of skill enpowerment; then i suppose

Bash +5 power +5 cooldown decrease and +4 power in Bleed or Trip.

As for the dmg issue it's clear a cleric'll never outdamage the other classes
(they would be useless if it would be possible) but it's also true that clerics in this game are more like paladins than priests with robes and sticks(in the chinese version of Fiesta maybe the class is more versatile because they have also ranged magic attacks) . The purpose of the build is to oustand the opponent while doing damage reasonably high enough to kill him not to compete with warriors in damage.

If +20 END isn't enough to oustand too many opponents on the cleric i suppose the solution is 1:1 STR/END or 2:1 END/STR

[Kholai]

Lies. I have fifteen points sunk into my Bash skill, empowering it in every way possible. The only restriction on empowerment points is what aspects of a skill you can empower, not how many.

I'm fascinated. What ranged magic attacks? Will we ever be seeing them?

As for build.... Critical hits and an unexpected bash are probably more likely to kill an enemy than constantly using bash and dealing constant, regular damage. Holding off on bash until they're within Bash's crit range, then letting loose and hoping for a sudden crit is going to take out the over confident and terminate them righteously. As would alternating weapons to stop them being able to get into a good tempo, and to mess up their clerics. Fighters have it on easy mode, with multiple attacks, all dealing different amounts of damage. Mages pump out the carnage. To kill as a cleric you need subterfuge, because you aren't outdamaging anyone's heal.

[ShinMegamiTensei]

As for build.... Critical hits and an unexpected bash are probably more likely to kill an enemy than constantly using bash and dealing constant, regular damage. Holding off on bash until they're within Bash's crit range, then letting loose and hoping for a sudden crit is going to take out the over confident and terminate them righteously. As would alternating weapons to stop them being able to get into a good tempo, and to mess up their clerics. Fighters have it on easy mode, with multiple attacks, all dealing different amounts of damage. Mages pump out the carnage. To kill as a cleric you need subterfuge, because you aren't outdamaging anyone's heal.


Thats the + 25 SPR issue. I've read in many posts that +5% crit dmg is important for the cleric,so i think to follow 2 kinds of build i've found in other threads:

1: + 25 SPR, then full STR

2:+25 SPR, then 2:1 STR/END

as for the skill enpowerment if there's no +10 limit then full bash enpowerment.

I've heard of the chinese version in another thread of this forum some time ago. A guy (i don't remember his name or the name of the thread either) posted a link to a web page with screenshots and the description (in english) of the chinese version. The game is more or less the same, but the graphic seems a lot better and the clerics( called priests) have melee and ranged attacks. I don't know if those informations were true or fake, but i don't think those priests can be good in healing and melee and ranged dps at the same time.

[Shahared]

Lies. I have fifteen points sunk into my Bash skill, empowering it in every way possible. The only restriction on empowerment points is what aspects of a skill you can empower, not how many.
I was unaware, because I was wrongly informed elsewhere, I did not intentionally 'lie'.
On a different note, I assumed this thread was about making a pvp build for a cleric not discussing the intricacies of combat...In any case I don't see having critical hit percentage of a measly plus 5% is going to help you much, maybe in a one on one situation...but so far pvp is war based...hence you can likely call for backup from the rest of the guild. Face it, one on one pvp with a cleric is still going to be a run and heal while waiting for backup kind of thing. And from what mages tell me, stat increase items don't increase your crit rate unless they specifically say they increase crit. There are some math geeks on a thread in the mages forum that have calculated the amount of damage you average with full spr compared to full int (similar to str for clerics) and the numbers do not work out very well...and I tend to trust the math geeks. At least str damage is a guarantee and a cleric with good end and reasonable str will be able to add more to the effort then a full spr support cleric...face it, your going to last longer in the fight and deal more damage with a end/str build..you will burn through stones, but you still are just as effective at healing as a support build at the expense of it costing you money...I think that full support clerics are just castrated servants who have to rely on parties just to survive...

[Kholai]

On a different note, I assumed this thread was about making a pvp build for a cleric not discussing the intricacies of combat...

Can't make one without understanding the other.



In any case I don't see having critical hit percentage of a measly plus 5% is going to help you much, maybe in a one on one situation...but so far pvp is war based...hence you can likely call for backup from the rest of the guild.

"Measly"? Perchance you do not grasp the importance of critical hits? +2% crit earrings, +5% from spirit, +5% from a nice green mace, and +5% from the new cash shop tuxedo. 17%, almost 1 in 5 hits is a critical.
It's exactly because backup, and healing, is so important that critical hits become important. Especially against a character with a cleric watching over them. Sudden, unexpected damage will work against a human opponent better than constant damage, because the latter can catch them off-guard, and kill them at a time they didn't think they needed to heal yet.


Face it, one on one pvp with a cleric is still going to be a run and heal while waiting for backup kind of thing. And from what mages tell me, stat increase items don't increase your crit rate unless they specifically say they increase crit.

What kind of failed cleric needs to retreat? Unless you're being attacked by four or five people at the same time, they're the ones who'll be fleeing. If you have a decently empowered bash, and, if SMT (love that game by the way) follows through on his idea for a full strength/spirit build, that will be doing very high spike damage.
Clerics need high spike damage more than any other class, because clerics can't outdamage someone's healing factor.

And congrats, you didn't know that base spirit didn't increase crit rate? This just makes adding points to spirit much better than boosting it with rings, which can then be switched with Strength boosting rings, to pump damage ever more.


There are some math geeks on a thread in the mages forum that have calculated the amount of damage you average with full spr compared to full int (similar to str for clerics) and the numbers do not work out very well...and I tend to trust the math geeks.

I'm a mathematics geek, and hybrid 25 Spirit, rest intelligence mage is better. This is irrelevant to a PvP build cleric however, since there is no chance that a cleric, even if they were full strength, could outdamage an equal level's combined ability to pot and stone.


At least str damage is a guarantee and a cleric with good end and reasonable str will be able to add more to the effort then a full spr support cleric...

Ummm.... Congrats, you've made a leap of logic going from "spirit is more useful for PvP than strength" to "yes, full spirit, ignoring the obvious cutoff point of 25 is the only way to go". A 25 spirit, rest endurance will not only mage some large numbers fly up, they'll be less vulnerable to mages, clerics' #1 enemy. Since you start out by talking about 5% crit, you're obviously deliberately trying to be daft, or you've had a fit of Alzheimer's.




For the record, I am now demanding Outspark stop holding out on us and give clerics a low damage ranged magic attack so's we can poke people with our lasers.

[TaintedHeir]

Clerics aren't designed for PvP. So naturally their dmg will be the lowest compared to the other classes. Because the only real damage clerics is Bash... and Trip/Bleed is still bugged, while fighters/archers/mages have multiple damage spells, you just can't compete. Try it in a friendly guild war though, the battle will just consist of you mostly doing self-heal because for every 1 Bash you do, a fighter can probably do 3-4 damage spells.

If you want a PvP character with lots of HP, do a fighter with some END.
omg zen... you of all people know clerics can own in gw easy... just lvl 44 and i'm +25 spr rest on str nad i can 1 hit with bash a lvl 38 and bellow mage (not to mention i weild a +9 ggk mace)

pvp clerics just need some str.. i'm starting to think about adding some end but want to wait until 50's so then i can go end when cap is lifted

[Shahared]

Can't make one without understanding the other.



"Measly"? Perchance you do not grasp the importance of critical hits? +2% crit earrings, +5% from spirit, +5% from a nice green mace, and +5% from the new cash shop tuxedo. 17%, almost 1 in 5 hits is a critical.
It's exactly because backup, and healing, is so important that critical hits become important. Especially against a character with a cleric watching over them. Sudden, unexpected damage will work against a human opponent better than constant damage, because the latter can catch them off-guard, and kill them at a time they didn't think they needed to heal yet.



What kind of failed cleric needs to retreat? Unless you're being attacked by four or five people at the same time, they're the ones who'll be fleeing. If you have a decently empowered bash, and, if SMT (love that game by the way) follows through on his idea for a full strength/spirit build, that will be doing very high spike damage.
Clerics need high spike damage more than any other class, because clerics can't outdamage someone's healing factor.

And congrats, you didn't know that base spirit didn't increase crit rate? This just makes adding points to spirit much better than boosting it with rings, which can then be switched with Strength boosting rings, to pump damage ever more.



I'm a mathematics geek, and hybrid 25 Spirit, rest intelligence mage is better. This is irrelevant to a PvP build cleric however, since there is no chance that a cleric, even if they were full strength, could outdamage an equal level's combined ability to pot and stone.



Ummm.... Congrats, you've made a leap of logic going from "spirit is more useful for PvP than strength" to "yes, full spirit, ignoring the obvious cutoff point of 25 is the only way to go". A 25 spirit, rest endurance will not only mage some large numbers fly up, they'll be less vulnerable to mages, clerics' #1 enemy. Since you start out by talking about 5% crit, you're obviously deliberately trying to be daft, or you've had a fit of Alzheimer's.




For the record, I am now demanding Outspark stop holding out on us and give clerics a low damage ranged magic attack so's we can poke people with our lasers.
Wow, your sarcasm and cynical attitude really are not necessary....I couldn't possibly have an opinion and be correct in your eyes so apparently my discussion on this matter is over...pity you couldn't be objective 'and' nice at the same time, but I guess thats what arrogance is for.....
P.S. You know not everyones opinion is an attack on your ego...sometimes it's just their opinion.

[zendragon]

omg zen... you of all people know clerics can own in gw easy... just lvl 44 and i'm +25 spr rest on str nad i can 1 hit with bash a lvl 38 and bellow mage (not to mention i weild a +9 ggk mace)

pvp clerics just need some str.. i'm starting to think about adding some end but want to wait until 50's so then i can go end when cap is lifted

Heir! That's where you went! To Bijou! I thought you died or something hahaha

and re-thinking my comment... i didnt build my cleric to have pvp in mind, that's why i had that opinion... but at high levels, with all the nice dmg items we can get... there would be possiblity for a pvp cleric but of course it wouldnt be as effecient as a fighter

[Kholai]

Wow, your sarcasm and cynical attitude really are not necessary....I couldn't possibly have an opinion and be correct in your eyes so apparently my discussion on this matter is over...pity you couldn't be objective 'and' nice at the same time, but I guess thats what arrogance is for.....
P.S. You know not everyones opinion is an attack on your ego...sometimes it's just their opinion.

My sarcasm and cynical attitude are part of my base personality, and I have neither the obligation, nor the inclination to sugarcoat any reply to you in order to suit your sensibilities, nor to ignore the fallacies in your argument in order to protect your fragile sense of self-esteem. Feel free to back out of this discussion, I lose nothing by your failure to continue your "argument".

Also, since your "opinion" devolved into an errant attack on full spirit clerics, I maintain you were either being obtuse, you forgot midway through your post what you were talking about, or you were attempting a deliberate attack on any and every perceived weakness in my post, none of which are my concern.
I believe it is also you, not I, whose ego feels bruised at the moment, presumably started from the time I indicated you were spreading a falsehood concerning maximum skill empowerment, and now only furthered by my brutal response to your subsequent post, leading to your current, rather sullen state, and failed personal attack.



Back on topic, there looks to be a sore letdown coming to the cleric class after the cap is lifted. The Uruga skill store offers:
No more levels in Bash, no more heal increases (the cleric's only instant recovery spell), and trip and bleed both fail appallingly. No more Protect, only one more level of Resist, which does not help the cleric anyway....
Compared to the continued upgrade of skills and introduction of greatly superior skills for every other class, the cleric is looking to become even worse damage dealers than they are now, and they won't even be seeing additional damage buffs to help their party. A level 59 cleric will be just as useful to their group as a level 79 will. And that's terrible.

[Gravvi]

well with additional stats and empowerments we will be doing about hte same damage. We just won't have to choose what ot empower. My bash is maxed already and i do way more damage than most But they odn't get a new skill so they need to enhance bash as much as needed. and we get rejuvienate which only takes.8 seconds. That isn't long.

[Shahared]

My sarcasm and cynical attitude are part of my base personality, and I have neither the obligation, nor the inclination to sugarcoat any reply to you in order to suit your sensibilities, nor to ignore the fallacies in your argument in order to protect your fragile sense of self-esteem. Feel free to back out of this discussion, I lose nothing by your failure to continue your "argument".

Also, since your "opinion" devolved into an errant attack on full spirit clerics, I maintain you were either being obtuse, you forgot midway through your post what you were talking about, or you were attempting a deliberate attack on any and every perceived weakness in my post, none of which are my concern.
I believe it is also you, not I, whose ego feels bruised at the moment, presumably started from the time I indicated you were spreading a falsehood concerning maximum skill empowerment, and now only furthered by my brutal response to your subsequent post, leading to your current, rather sullen state, and failed personal attack.
My point proven...I couldn't possibly have an opinion and be correct in your eyes....the fact that you take what I say and twist it to suit your own point of view as to how I feel or what my intentions in posting are prove it...
As for the topic at hand, I agree with you, it is sad that there is no increase in the usefulness of th cleric at higher levels as the game is now...I certainly hope there are planned changes in that area. Idk how I feel about ranged attacks (as was previously discussed) for clerics considering there are already two classes that have them and in the idea of balance that would seem like a sticky area. Maybe it would bring more balance to the side of the cleric but I think I would personally prefer a larger variety of buffs and protection based skills...
Going back to the post made (even though you were 'quite' negative towards me) as a counterpoint to my opinions about cleric PVP, I think there are some things to take into consideration. One thing is that while increasing a clerics usefulness in PVP there has to also be care in ensuring that there is no increase advantage in single player or partied PVC combat.
One of the points I would like to touch on in that reply was increased one time hits for clerics...In my opinion they would also make a cleric slightly overpowered in team combat against boss mobs. Think of this situation: Tank attacks mob, cleric casts invincible on tank, runs in to do some big spiked up damage hits on the mob, drops back to heal. While this would increase the usefulness in PVP allot I think it would almost eliminate the need for extra players in a party under some circumstances. Of course the more the merrier but it could be an impact (my opinion).
But we both digress from the main topic, a good build for a battle cleric..my point was about a str/end cleric being better then a full spr cleric...(Which you seem to think I meant a hybrid spr 25 cleric, then str end, which I did not mean...) I still have that opinion...The fact that there are items that increase crit for later levels just solidifies my opinion. I think that I would just prefer to have the points in a solid guaranteed stat. I know this is for straight pvp discussion but I still know that some of the time I play will be training and whatnot and I think it is more useful (just my opinion, a counterpoint not a derision to your opinion).
To touch on crit rate consider this, even with the items described above (one of which is a pay item) 17% is more like 1 in 6, and you also fail to take into consideration the block percentage of the enemy (if they have any, I know not all do). I'm not saying its bad..by far spr is good and useful at that level..but 5% isn't, that was all I was trying to say. If you gear your cleric to spr I think you are absolutely right, you would get good critical hits, but also consider gearing him toward str. With items equipped to increas str, maybe some earrings to increase your spr a bit I think you would do good in a slugfest that would last a while and you didn't have to stop allot to heal. If you did have to stop allot to heal because your getting hit for allot of damage at a fast rate this would not be good, then your spr hybrid would be much better (mostly because of the chance to hit a 'lucky' high damage shot between heals). Personally I value consistent damage more is all. I feel that way only based on previous situations I have been in where I was taking damage fast and was able to still hit quite often between the times I needed to cast heal.