A Modest Proposal (Raid Calendar)

[sufjams]

tl;bDr - Too long; But DO Read. Every Guild Master should go through this.

Intro.

Lately, I have spoken to a lot of people on our server about their aims and aspirations within this game, and have found that they all share similar sentiments. Everyone wants to be able hang out with their friends and accrue some great gear to play the game the way it was meant to be played.

They also, however, share an underlying concern - that the latter desire (to attain prestigious gear) is out of their reach, and will continue to become more so as time goes on due to guild politics and an imbalance of power in regards to guilds and end-game activities. The guild with this power, as we all know, is Insanity.

Go Insanity!

First, let it be known that Insanity should be very proud of coming as far as they have. They've worked hard to bolster their numbers, take down bosses, and create some of the strongest players on the server. I have a lot of good friends in Insanity, and was actually a member when the guild was first created.

That being said, let's address some of the hostility towards them. Put simply, the rest of us play this game and pay our hard earned money to do more than just pat these guys on the back. Though we're all proud of them, not everyone is ready to abandon their friends in order to join and get a shot at some decent gear. Everybody wants a chance, and nobody, not even those benefiting (were chance less kind to them and stuck them with less fortunate associations,) would deny that a monopoly is unfair to the vast majority in favor of the minority.

This tendency to push forward and attain as much as possible at the expense of others, however, is natural to human nature. We're animals, and Insanity should not be discredited or disliked because of their success.

On Selfishness (Its Benefits, Flaws) And How To Work With It.

Let us take for granted that people are selfish. One might say that, because we're animals, power shifts like what has happened with Insanity are inevitable and we should accept and work around that - either by joining or changing our goals. To that I say that though we are animals, we're social animals, and were we to cave in to our instincts, we'd be nowhere. We have diplomacy.

You see, selfishness helps us attain goals, but at the same time sets back the community, which in the end sets back everyone. Any system that attempts to ensure social prosperity is a sort of contract that we all have to sign. Nobody would sign the contract before going in if they knew they'd be one of the ones disadvantaged for the sake of a few who aren't. We have to realize the random chance of our prosperity and extend an olive branch to those less fortunate. This is basic political/moral theory.

So, any social system that can possibly work, takes into account selfishness, but does not cave in to it.

A Solution: Raid Calendar.

There are a lot of problems that plague us. As guilds, we're too proud to merge, we have too much loyalty to help other guilds in raids, and those with power have become elite and untouchable. This proposed solution, I feel, addresses them all. With it, we can maintain our friends by keeping our guilds, all attain good gear, and still work together with no hostility to ensure that no one group betrays the rest.

The idea is to establish a Raid Calendar, for Malephar right now (since that's the most hotly sought after boss) and down the road other events, like Helga. At the moment, Helga is less of a concern because Insanity is the only guild powerful enough to take him down alone.

Anyway, assume we have 5 guilds who want and can take down Malephar. To qualify for the calendar, they must have some minimum number of 105 characters who can use his gear. Based on this number of 105s, each guild is given a rating. 'X' is the rating.

Guild A has X 105s.
Guild B has X 105s.
Guild C has X 105s.
Guild D has X 105s.
Guild E has X 105s.

From that, we establish a ratio between the ratings. X : X : X : X : X, and divvy up the spawns per week to reflect this, this ensuring each guild gets enough kills as is fair for the number of players they have who can use the dropped gear.

Say the ratio is 10 : 7 : 4 : 4 : 2, starting from Guild A all the way through E. There are 14 Malephar spawns a week. That would equal kills for each of the 5 groups equal to 5 : 4 : 2 : 2 : 1.

Group A would get their kills in a block of 2 ½ days. Then report the last kill time to group B. And so on until the last group gets the last kill of the week.

A new tally would be done every Sunday to figure out this power figure for each participating guild. I would volunteer to do a bulk of this work, but a collaborative effort from every guild master would be required to some small degree.

I cannot think of a more fair way to go about competitive spawns than this. Or a more intelligent or civil way. And we're intelligent, civil people, aren't we?

There will, obviously, have to be amendments to compensate for unforeseen problems. Say Guild C botches their run or can't get enough people in time. In response to that, I feel Guild A (the most powerful guild and the one in need of the most gear) should take over all failed runs of other guilds. Subtracting variables, right now, that guild would be Insanity, and would probably continue to be for a very long time.

The goal of this, again, is not to overthrow Insanity. Not by any means, they've earned their power and position! But it is to give everyone the chance they deserve. And we can calculate that chance into a quantifiable number, lol.

Furthermore, all of the math will be made public, all of the guild ratings will be made public, and the contributions and criticisms of everyone will be crucial to this system remaining fair to all! Cooperation from the Outspark admins in stickying the calendar would help, but otherwise we could make a private forum where everyone is encouraged to read, interject, and make the system better and more fair each week that goes by.

An Obvious Complaint.

Anybody reading this has already asked themselves, "What will make any one guild not steal kills if they can?" The answer is, we all will. Consider this something like the United Nations, or NATO.

If one guild oversteps its boundaries and tries to steal from another, we will all discourage it strongly via actions at that offending guild's next raid. Be it warring them, or just generally reminding them of the importance of the system. Communication will be critical. There should, however, be no reason for cheating. All guilds participating will be in compliance with this, and stubborn guilds or Republicans (lol) will be encouraged to join.

Why Even The Strongest Guild Has Incentive To Join.

Every guild inevitably has its downfall. Even the strongest. This is often because of internal strife, poor management, or generally, greed. Greed is the underlying reason, and is the cause of most all other reasons. If everyone is working together to ensure we all get what we want (to stay with our own guilds/friends, as well as to get good gear,) the prosperity of all guilds (including the strongest) is much more ensured.

Resentment towards one guild amongst many or all other guilds has a tipping point where it almost always incites this sort of downfall in the guild at fault.

If everything is out in the open, everyone's getting a fair share equal to what they deserve, and nobody feels cheated, every guild will last much longer.

Also, in reality, as it stands Insanity has a great favoring in the 105+ ratings, and the divvying up wouldn't be as broad as it is in my example. They would get, right now, most of the week. Because that's fair. They need the most kills. There's math to prove it.

Afterthoughts.

Work has to be done still, but this is very feasible. I encourage everyone to read this (if you're this far you already have) and to tell others to read it. The input of guild masters will be critical, as communication between them will be very important. Please give me feedback and a post here, or a message in game to discuss something (this is Omie.) I can give you my MSN handle on request via message.

A New Guild To Promote This Spirit Of Fairness

I think a lot of guilds these days are run unfairly. I think people sincerely dislike being shafted on drops and opportunities because of some vague system of seniority and elitism that nobody will explain to them.

I will very shortly be creating a new guild to reflect my distaste for this. There will be a new thread here shortly outlining it in precise detail, but for the time being a brief synopsis will do.

In this guild, drops will be bid upon by members using points that they earn for each hour of participation in raids, farming SL, farming LN, etc. The quantities of points earned will be outlined later to explain the balance, and other ways to earn points will be explained too.

Some examples of these other ways are: Donating gold to the academy may earn a percentage of a point, selling blues earned with the guild back to the guild storage to be bid upon by other members will earn points, and perhaps even selling gear attained outside of the guild to the guild at a discount will earn some percentage of a point, or points.

Points will be tallied by myself and the handful of other admins that are to be selected, and any event that yields points will have an admin present. Weekly, a spreadsheet of these points (how many each player has and where they were earned) will be posted to our forums.

I have spoken to people and already have support for this. My goal is not to make the next super powerful guild. Not at all - I couldn't care less. Just to make the most fair guild that can possibly be made. There will be no room for favoritism, no room for cheating, no room for hostility. Someone who's been in the guild for two months will be punished the same as someone who's been in it for twenty minutes for the same offense. If there's someone in the guild that you don't like, don't worry. They, and everyone else, will be kept in check, and cheating on their behalf will be absolutely impossible.

Everyone will have a fair shot, everyone will know exactly where they stand, and no one will ever feel cheated. If you support this idea, please consult me about joining in a post here, in a message, or in the thread that I add later which will outline the guild and its policies and point system in detail very soon.

Guild requirement to start will be 95+, and in the future will be raised to 100+. The requirement for bidding will be the level that the gear can be used, but points can be earned before reaching the level to bid. The goal is not to make a handful of strong players to define the guild, but to make everyone as powerful as everyone can be, in the fairest way possible.

More on this later! For now, the calendar system. I just wanted to mention this while I have an audience. Thank you for taking the time to read this, and I trust everyone will pursue the idea with the intelligence and maturity that I know this server possesses.

[omni.knight]

<3 omie :) 1st rep :D

[missskita7]

So, obviously---in a nutshell, You want to destroy the powerful guilds, and become the GM of a NEW powerful guild and reap the rewards by making people PAY you for the privilege of raiding. I say, No thanks. We have worked too hard to have people come and destroy what we have worked hard for.

[el_cabron]

Noted......

[lilmo6]

As far as i am concerned there already is a "raid calender". Your just not on it.

[hithar_]

He even emphasized how he had no intention of "destroying" Insanity, he merely wants other guilds to have a chance to raid. And he didn't say anything about making people PAY him to raid, the point system is based on participation, not gold or anything. Plus, Insanity will still have the most raids and the most power, etc.

[missskita7]

"
Some examples of these other ways are: Donating gold to the academy may earn a percentage of a point, selling blues earned with the guild back to the guild storage to be bid upon by other members will earn points, and perhaps even selling gear attained outside of the guild to the guild at a discount will earn some percentage of a point, or points. "



Really? this is not profiting.

and LOLZ!! @limo6 this is true!

[tintin1]

Well... wait til all the noobs get to 100+ and make a big guild... probally can do boss raids easy. Go recruit Omie

[hithar_]

Selling blues back for points* not gold.
Plus donating to the academy benefits the whole guild, not himself, solely.

[dj-kittenz]

No way Im in insanity and were epic keep things the same </3

[lillyvalla]

hmm nice thought...but tbh this is an old idea....from Apo.....get a new idea pl0x.

[sufjams]

Anna, you misread. No profit is made. It's purely participation points. The other methods of gaining points (selling old blues back to the guild storage) mean selling them for points to bid on new gear.

The guild I proposed is a small one, close knit one. Not everyone is as diabolical as you seem to think, haha.

[blackrose338]

the flaw in the system for getting raid drops is rich ppl can get as many as they want by just repeatedly donating money and going to just as many raids as everybody else x; instead of voting and giving to ppl that DESERVE them more(meaning ppl tht do more for the guild outside donating)

[sufjams]

The guild I proposed is an afterthought, for a small group of responsible people who don't want to feel cheated, and want to know exactly where we stand. Not a power play. To clear that up, lol.

[sufjams]

the flaw in the system for getting raid drops is rich ppl can get as many as they want by just repeatedly donating money and going to just as many raids as everybody else x; instead of voting and giving to ppl that DESERVE them more(meaning ppl tht do more for the guild outside donating)

There would be very low cap on that, and it would probably only be open at all when the acad is empty. Like I said, this is only a short synopsis.

[missskita7]

Anna, you misread. No profit is made. It's purely participation points. The other methods of gaining points (selling old blues back to the guild storage) mean selling them for points to bid on new gear.

The guild I proposed is a small one, close knit one. Not everyone is as diabolical as you seem to think, haha.

Please don't assume on me kthx! :)

[hithar_]

the flaw in the system for getting raid drops is rich ppl can get as many as they want by just repeatedly donating money and going to just as many raids as everybody else x; instead of voting and giving to ppl that DESERVE them more(meaning ppl tht do more for the guild outside donating)

That's doesn't define the whole system, and can easily be changed.

[apallday]

Ok well first off let me say there will be no "raid calender". We tried this and were betrayed by your very own guild members. So if you want to raid show up with a good prty after all there is no such thing as ks'ing bosses so we welcome your efforts.

second what you dont realize is that we allowed your guild to have raids we had a proposal worked out with them, they got ****y for some strange reason that we never figured out and broke the deal. There was a couple people inparticular that ruined it for you, so dont blame us for this. We were completly fair with you untill we got stabbed in the back.

3rd we let anyone who asks for raids to raid without our interference. except ofc those who stab us in the back. We are a completly fair guild. Although you may hear differently from the people who did us wrong.

4th, anymore questions?

[Michelle_Aerro]

It seems to me you are a controll freak, and you are tring to cheat the players better than you.
If they can get all the drops they will sell them cause they can't use them all. you will be taking alot of money out of peoples pockets. Are we going to set up a system so every player has a turn killing King Kong Phinlfly?

[zonyy76]

First Insanity is to elitist to ever back something like this. sad to say. but that is how this server has been since insanity came to power. the real problem lays in the upper power vacuum that exists in the top 10 guilds. insanity is hands down well above all other guilds and is not challenged in anyway. This in turn has brought a sense of invincibly to its members. because the top guild is not challenged they can pretty much do and control what they want. AKA the Kill stealing of bosses. this does not mean that all of Insanity is like that but 1 bad apple will spoil the bunch. and believe me their are more then 1 in that group. but this does not fall on Insanity alone it falls upon the lack of leadership in other guilds also. the one thing this server needs is a server counsel consisting of gms of many guilds. Not just the top 10!
Active GMS for guilds should be voted in to the counsel through some sort of voting process and stay on the counsel for a term that we all deem appropriate . This counsel can then in turn make the decisions for raids and other server wide issues that arise. but here in lays the next flaw to the idea in that everything would need to be impartial and honest. Gamers and honesty well thats a oxy moron in it self. so though I agree with the above ideas to some extent i believe that the issue will fall upon the GMS forming some type of counsel to ensure that there is a standard to be followed by all.

[hithar_]

It seems to me you are a controll freak, and you are tring to cheat the players better than you.
If they can get all the drops they will sell them cause they can't use them all. you will be taking alot of money out of peoples pockets. Are we going to set up a system so every player has a turn killing King Kong Phinlfly?

Insanity doesn't sell gears, they hoard them in their storage.

[tintin1]

Why are you guys acting like this is new to yall.... Its fiesta. Fiesta = Friends + Fun + Drama + Hate + Jealousy. Keep it simple.... Absolute POWER PWNS ALL!

[sufjams]

Ok well first off let me say there will be no "raid calender". We tried this and were betrayed by your very own guild members. So if you want to raid show up with a good prty after all there is no such thing as ks'ing bosses so we welcome your efforts.

second what you dont realize is that we allowed your guild to have raids we had a proposal worked out with them, they got ****y for some strange reason that we never figured out and broke the deal. There was a couple people inparticular that ruined it for you, so dont blame us for this. We were completly fair with you untill we got stabbed in the back.

3rd we let anyone who asks for raids to raid without our interference. except ofc those who stab us in the back. We are a completly fair guild. Although you may hear differently from the people who did us wrong.

4th, anymore questions?

To Fina:

Please don't associate it as my guild. I wasn't in it when that happened. You yourself told me about that after I joined, and actions like that are why something like this is necessary. In that instance, AAO would be the one punished, not Insanity.

If you're open to sharing raids, that's fantastic. Then all this calendar would do is make that information public. The method of splitting could be more on your terms. That's why there has to be a discussion on how it will work.

[blackrose338]

First Insanity is to elitist to ever back something like this. sad to say. but that is how this server has been since insanity came to power. the real problem lays in the upper power vacuum that exists in the top 10 guilds. insanity is hands down well above all other guilds and is not challenged in anyway. This in turn has brought a sense of invincibly to its members. because the top guild is not challenged they can pretty much do and control what they want. AKA the Kill stealing of bosses. this does not mean that all of Insanity is like that but 1 bad apple will spoil the bunch. and believe me their are more then 1 in that group. but this does not fall on Insanity alone it falls upon the lack of leadership in other guilds also. the one thing this server needs is a server counsel consisting of gms of many guilds. Not just the top 10!
Active GMS for guilds should be voted in to the counsel through some sort of voting process and stay on the counsel for a term that we all deem appropriate . This counsel can then in turn make the decisions for raids and other server wide issues that arise. but here in lays the next flaw to the idea in that everything would need to be impartial and honest. Gamers and honesty well thats a oxy moron in it self. so though I agree with the above ideas to some extent i believe that the issue will fall upon the GMS forming some type of counsel to ensure that there is a standard to be followed by all.

umm....we shared male with AAO, got KS'd...we share with other guilds when they ask and it works out great...and like he said we do it in proportion to the no. of 105's to decide how many raids they each guild gets a week

[sufjams]

Also, I'm not a control freak. I'm offering to do a bit of community service in this effort. I've never cheated anyone in this game in all the years I've played.

[hithar_]

Ok well first off let me say there will be no "raid calender". We tried this and were betrayed by your very own guild members. So if you want to raid show up with a good prty after all there is no such thing as ks'ing bosses so we welcome your efforts.

second what you dont realize is that we allowed your guild to have raids we had a proposal worked out with them, they got ****y for some strange reason that we never figured out and broke the deal. There was a couple people inparticular that ruined it for you, so dont blame us for this. We were completly fair with you untill we got stabbed in the back.

3rd we let anyone who asks for raids to raid without our interference. except ofc those who stab us in the back. We are a completly fair guild. Although you may hear differently from the people who did us wrong.

4th, anymore questions?

So what if the people who "stabbed you in the back" are no longer here?

[lillyvalla]

Ok heres and idea....why don't we this weekend all go raid karen with every guild on the server eh? sounds fun? lets try it any objections?

[BloodMage78]

Ok well first off let me say there will be no "raid calender". We tried this and were betrayed by your very own guild members. So if you want to raid show up with a good prty after all there is no such thing as ks'ing bosses so we welcome your efforts.

second what you dont realize is that we allowed your guild to have raids we had a proposal worked out with them, they got ****y for some strange reason that we never figured out and broke the deal. There was a couple people inparticular that ruined it for you, so dont blame us for this. We were completly fair with you untill we got stabbed in the back.

3rd we let anyone who asks for raids to raid without our interference. except ofc those who stab us in the back. We are a completly fair guild. Although you may hear differently from the people who did us wrong.

4th, anymore questions?

QFT.
Insanity pride.

I think everything is running fine on the server. Those who deserve a spawn have one.

[phreakshot]

Although I am 5 levels short of 105 character, I think this is a brilliant proposal. I support this idea. It's well thought out at this stage and hopefully others will be enlightened by it. The spirit of it would be good for the Cypion community on a whole by bringing fairness and fostering stronger ties of friendship and camaraderie. Cutting out the animosity is a must; I'm tired of, we are all tired of it. We need a positive change and this is it. A Raid Calendar would benefit guilds and the individual players in that guild Playing Fiesta in this fair environment would make a return of a more enjoyable gaming experience; for many of us who have been disappointment of the late, we would welcome it.

[apallday]

So what if the people who "stabbed you in the back" are no longer here?

Anyone who was there while the stabbing was being done is "black listed to us". Anyone who wasnt there your welcome to pm anyone of our admins for your own personal raid times.

[el_cabron]

The supposed "savior of the server" will have no part in malephar raids ever. thats one of ppl that wont be participating.

[missskita7]

I am not for publicizing the "calendar" we have set up. Because it will allow people who are jerks to ks the weaker and smaller guilds.

Omie, you may be a fair guy and all, but like how we are accused of having "bad apples" so does your guild, and others.

You cannot blame us for building and leading a guild and then blame us again for others falling apart. We note your plea, but obviously you are out of the loop. Don't assume things that are not true. We work actively with people, we just don't publicize it cause people can go and ruin their raids.

Basically, I read this as an indirect way to flame our guild, because you singled us out. But, I will remain positive and i believe with this, you will make our guild stronger. We become closer when we are being attacked unfairly.

[Michelle_Aerro]

It seems to me you are a coltroll freak, and are tring to cheat players better than you. If they can get all the drops they deserve to have them, they can keep the ones with the best stats and sell the rest.
You will have a chance to buy them eventually if you can pay what they ask for them. Are we going to set up a system for every player to have a turn at tring to kill King Kong Phinofly next? I say we keep the game a free enterprise.

[hithar_]

I am not for publicizing the "calendar" we have set up. Because it will allow people who are jerks to ks the weaker and smaller guilds.

Omie, you may be a fair guy and all, but like how we are accused of having "bad apples" so does your guild, and others.

You cannot blame us for building and leading a guild and then blame us again for others falling apart. We note your plea, but obviously you are out of the loop. Don't assume things that are not true. We work actively with people, we just don't publicize it cause people can go and ruin their raids.

Basically, I read this as an indirect way to flame our guild, because you singled us out. But, I will remain positive and i believe with this, you will make our guild stronger. We become closer when we are being attacked unfairly.

You obviously did not read the section where he said "Go Insanity!"
And he mentioned Insanity because you guys are basically the only ones raiding.

[missskita7]

You obviously did not read the section where he said "Go Insanity!"
And he mentioned Insanity because you guys are basically the only ones raiding.

Oh I read it.. as passive aggressive. I should report as flaming, but :) I wont. Because we will only become stronger with you guys raining on us with false assumptions.

[apallday]

Anna is right, when "unamed guild" betrayed us and broke our deal. It made our entire guild unite like never b4. This will do the same so in all fairness I will thank you. When you push us we can honestly push back alot harder XD!

[sufjams]

Nobody's attacking Insanity, Anna. I praise them and deflect the criticism against Insanity.

I duly note now why you won't publicize it, people will KS weaker guilds. But if you're sharing kills, that's fantastic. I was unaware, and am still, I suppose, to the extent that you do it. But still, that's great.

My only goal was for people to have a way of knowing that they can get kills to and they don't have to abandon their friends to get a shot. If Insanity can't publicize who's raiding, then they should post the criteria for being given raids. So people at least know how and when they can.

[sufjams]

This is no flame on Insanity! Haha. It's a plea for other guilds to know how they can get raids in too. If someone wronged you, I support blacklisting them. That's exactly what I propose in the calendar.

[rugnicon]

Zzzz. Sorry - Looks like some pawns are talking when they really shouldn't be. o.o

I wasn't aware there was a raid calendar, and hats off to Insanity for sharing, when they all in all, don't have to. Good job guys, can't wait until me and mine are big enough to give a shot at a raid or so. Might be awhile. Zzz.

Do like the idea of a council, a lot of issues that are happening server wide would be greatly benefited ( I don't know who my auto-spell check follows, but man, that looks like a weird spelling of Benefited. Meh. x.x )

From what I can tell, no one has voiced up that they HAVEN'T been allowed to raid because Insanity has been hoarding the raids. o.o Unless I just skim read something important. I know No-Drama have had their shots, or are getting their shots, apparently AAO have issues, though from the sounds of it, not unfairly.

*shrugs* I'm not a fan of Insanity, no offense meant folks, but all in all. They're not being particularly unfair, in my opinion. Will reply in morning when this thread is 20 pages long. Zzz. Nighty night.

~Rugnicon, GM of Ah_Skeet_Skeet

( Recently LOL'd about what our initials are. AgainstAllOdds = AAO, OneWingedAngels = OWA, Ah_Skeet_Skeet = ... ... Yeah. xD )

[bladenick]

Anna is right, when "unamed guild" betrayed us and broke our deal. It made our entire guild unite like never b4. This will do the same so in all fairness I will thank you. When you push us we can honestly push back alot harder XD!

Wait Didn't the so called savior solo your guild and win with you all online after a raid when you were all charmed


Just saying you don't push that hard Im going back to PS3 now

This sums it up SEP is leonidas insanity is Xerxes
[removed]

[BloodMage78]

Wait Didn't the so called savior solo your guild and win with you all online after a raid when you were all charmed


Just saying you don't push that hard Im going back to PS3 now

This sums it up SEP is leonidas insanity is Xerxes
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dO2i9aX2Xzs

Fail flame is fail.

[apallday]

Wait Didn't the so called savior solo your guild and win with you all online after a raid when you were all charmed


Just saying you don't push that hard Im going back to PS3 now

really? lmao, omg im laughing so hard i cant breath. Solo our guild? you mean kill afk people that were vending then warp away when theres a fight? Ya if you think thats something to be proud of then yep he whooped our butts he totally spanked each and every one of us.

See omie? this is exactly why we dont let certain people/guilds raid. What do you think would happen if this person was to obtain a 105 weapon? He would run around from town to town screaming how epic he is and how no one could ever be better then him. Tell me omie how is that gonna mke the sever a better place?

[omnipotentnicky]

First off, I believe what Omie is trying to attempt here is a slight order to the server. Though I have expressed my feelings toward his idea already, I will admit this is an issue that should be addressed. For someone to say a single person will not be allowed to participate in a raid, is solely inappropriate. To try to hold someone back from anything by ANY means within an MMO where all players are supposed to be treated equal?

I support this idea because it makes sense. It means fairness to any and all, who have done right or wrong in the past. No one single person should be held back within the game because you don't like them, or what they've done to you and yours. It is unfair and simply dumb. Omie, I really do wish you luck with this, I truly do, because fairness is something most top guilds lack towards smaller guilds. All deserve a chance, and all deserve their spot. Even the Savior.

I will support this idea, and I hope many others can as well.

[bladenick]

really? lmao, omg im laughing so hard i cant breath. Solo our guild? you mean kill afk people that were vending then warp away when theres a fight? Ya if you think thats something to be proud of then yep he whooped our butts he totally spanked each and every one of us.

See omie? this is exactly why we dont let certain people/guilds raid. What do you think would happen if this person was to obtain a 105 weapon? He would run around from town to town screaming how epic he is and how no one could ever be better then him. Tell me omie how is that gonna mke the sever a better place?

Did he win the war and tank you guys for 30 mins + I think he did

[apallday]

First off, I believe what Omie is trying to attempt here is a slight order to the server. Though I have expressed my feelings toward his idea already, I will admit this is an issue that should be addressed. For someone to say a single person will not be allowed to participate in a raid, is solely inappropriate. To try to hold someone back from anything by ANY means within an MMO where all players are supposed to be treated equal?

I support this idea because it makes sense. It means fairness to any and all, who have done right or wrong in the past. No one single person should be held back within the game because you don't like them, or what they've done to you and yours. It is unfair and simply dumb. Omie, I really do wish you luck with this, I truly do, because fairness is something most top guilds lack towards smaller guilds. All deserve a chance, and all deserve their spot. Even the Savior.

I will support this idea, and I hope many others can as well.
You had your chance like others who asked,you all made your bed now lie in it.

[omnipotentnicky]

You're singling out any and all members of AAO. Who are you to tell me what my chances are, what I deserve and don't deserve?

[hithar_]

You had your chance like others who asked,you all made your bed now lie in it.

Forgive and forget? So everyone can work this out maturely instead of holding a pointless grudge. Like Nicky said, people should be given a second chance, and people will change if they are forgiven. If not, then you have reason to enforce punishment.

[morgain_lefay]

in the end it doesnt matter, i will kill you all anyways :D hehehe

[blackrose338]

Forgive and forget? So everyone can work this out maturely instead of holding a pointless grudge. Like Nicky said, people should be given a second chance, and people will change if they are forgiven. If not, then you have reason to enforce punishment.

prove they have changed first? no reason to give a second chance until they show they wont just do it all over again ._.

[Michelle_Aerro]

Easy solution, just players over 105 from all guilds raid together,and take drops in sequence. This idea of only raiding with your click is kind of childish. I am sure there is probably at least 1 guild out there that has only 1 player over 105.

[master_aiucard]

Fail flame is fail.

I found it funny <3



For real tho if the things i say upset everyone so much i really am sorry im joking in case everyone misses the LOL's at the end of every roar

[BloodMage78]

Here's my 2 cents.

Kudos to Omie for making the thread. He's been inactive for a bit so he's missed out on the events that have happened in the recent past. Well constructed and put together post regarding raid times.

However, I personally believe that Insanity, namely the masters, are doing an awesome job as to communicating raid times between guilds that have asked and cooperated with Insanity. From what I'm aware of, every guild that was qualified for Male was given a fair chance. Some blew it and others cooperated. To me this thread seems like it's all Insanity's fault as to why a specific guild doesn't have a raid time. It's just hidden in the text to try and mask it's true intentions. Again, I do know for a fact we do keep track of raids and times; I know for a fact we aren't the only guild raiding Male.


Let us take for granted that people are selfish. One might say that, because we're animals, power shifts like what has happened with Insanity are inevitable and we should accept and work around that - either by joining or changing our goals. To that I say that though we are animals, we're social animals, and were we to cave in to our instincts, we'd be nowhere. We have diplomacy.

You see, selfishness helps us attain goals, but at the same time sets back the community, which in the end sets back everyone. Any system that attempts to ensure social prosperity is a sort of contract that we all have to sign. Nobody would sign the contract before going in if they knew they'd be one of the ones disadvantaged for the sake of a few who aren't. We have to realize the random chance of our prosperity and extend an olive branch to those less fortunate. This is basic political/moral theory.

So, any social system that can possibly work, takes into account selfishness, but does not cave in to it.

I'm on the fence with this theory. I personally don't raid in hopes for better gear. I love raiding with my guild cause it shows how well we work together and it makes us even closer. I'd go to raids even if I knew 100% that I'd never get a drop. I'd be happy working as a team and accomplishing goals as a guild. Just the satisfaction of working as a team to accomplish a goal makes me happy.


There are a lot of problems that plague us. As guilds, we're too proud to merge, we have too much loyalty to help other guilds in raids, and those with power have become elite and untouchable. This proposed solution, I feel, addresses them all. With it, we can maintain our friends by keeping our guilds, all attain good gear, and still work together with no hostility to ensure that no one group betrays the rest.

I think this contradicts your idea of creating your idea of a fair guild. It's exactly that, people are too proud to drop their guild at the hopes of another guild that may possibly not even succeed. (Not saying it won't). Sure you'll get the few people who think it sounds like a good idea, and maybe people who follow. From what I've seen on this server is that people just keep making new guilds in hopes that one will succeed more then the other one. This just separates people even more.


Anybody reading this has already asked themselves, "What will make any one guild not steal kills if they can?" The answer is, we all will. Consider this something like the United Nations, or NATO.

If one guild oversteps its boundaries and tries to steal from another, we will all discourage it strongly via actions at that offending guild's next raid. Be it warring them, or just generally reminding them of the importance of the system. Communication will be critical. There should, however, be no reason for cheating. All guilds participating will be in compliance with this, and stubborn guilds or Republicans (lol) will be encouraged to join.

I think we've already covered this, we gave everyone a fair shot at Male, certain people disobeyed the rules so they lost their privileges.


Every guild inevitably has its downfall. Even the strongest. This is often because of internal strife, poor management, or generally, greed. Greed is the underlying reason, and is the cause of most all other reasons. If everyone is working together to ensure we all get what we want (to stay with our own guilds/friends, as well as to get good gear,) the prosperity of all guilds (including the strongest) is much more ensured.

Resentment towards one guild amongst many or all other guilds has a tipping point where it almost always incites this sort of downfall in the guild at fault.

If everything is out in the open, everyone's getting a fair share equal to what they deserve, and nobody feels cheated, every guild will last much longer.

Also, in reality, as it stands Insanity has a great favoring in the 105+ ratings, and the divvying up wouldn't be as broad as it is in my example. They would get, right now, most of the week. Because that's fair. They need the most kills. There's math to prove it.


I'm not sure if this was intentionally aimed at Insanity but I feel it was. Any drama Insanity has dealt with, internal or external, has just made us stronger. From when I joined to current, I feel that we've only become closer and stronger and will continue to grow.


Work has to be done still, but this is very feasible. I encourage everyone to read this (if you're this far you already have) and to tell others to read it. The input of guild masters will be critical, as communication between them will be very important. Please give me feedback and a post here, or a message in game to discuss something (this is Omie.) I can give you my MSN handle on request via message.

I agree, word does have to be done, but not on Insanity's end. We've done plenty and more to make an effort in accommodating the server with raid time. Like I said before, others proved worthy and some didn't. Actions speak louder then words.


Good luck with your guild Omie.

[sufjams]

Yeah Echo, I'm not fully in touch with the extent to which Insanity has helped other guilds raid. I'm glad they do, that was my only intent.

The paragraph on guilds failing, was under the premise that all other guilds were being shafted. If that's not true, then that paragraph must be amended accordingly. Still though, it holds that if everyone is happy at once, everyone stays happy longer.

The only thing now is that guilds need to know what they have to do to attain a chance at a raid. It's unfortunate the raid calendar can't be made public, but if stronger guilds KSing weaker guilds is a real threat, I understand why it isn't. But the knowledge of how to raid at least needs to be made public. I'm an advocate of transparency to whatever extent it can safely be reached.

[blackrose338]

I agree with echo. and like i said before, yes people deserve a second chance but ONLY if they show they deserve it and some people, no names, haven't done a single thing to prove that they deserve a 2nd chance.

We WILL share male and we HAVE been sharing male with guilds that cooperate with us to make it more fair, its just some people don't realize it or don't think to ask, and instead prefer us to come tell them we will share with them.

If people want to raid all they have to do is ask and cooperate fairly and they have all gotten a chance to raid so far, and they get certain numbers of raids in proportion to the amount of 105's they have compared to other guilds raiding.
So to end this, when the people that have proven untrustworthy before prove they deserve a 2nd chance and they can get it maybe? if there is a proven fact that they have changed and won't just betray us again ._.

[master_aiucard]

I agree with echo. and like i said before, yes people deserve a second chance but ONLY if they show they deserve it and some people, no names, haven't done a single thing to prove that they deserve a 2nd chance.

We WILL share male and we HAVE been sharing male with guilds that cooperate with us to make it more fair, its just some people don't realize it or don't think to ask, and instead prefer us to come tell them we will share with them.

If people want to raid all they have to do is ask and cooperate fairly and they have all gotten a chance to raid so far, and they get certain numbers of raids in proportion to the amount of 105's they have compared to other guilds raiding.
So to end this, when the people that have proven untrustworthy before prove they deserve a 2nd chance and they can get it maybe? if there is a proven fact that they have changed and won't just betray us again ._.



LOL do tell how to prove this

[BloodMage78]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought this certain group was given a second chance.

[blackrose338]

Umm idk...that's your job ^^ lol sorry =P but its the truth ANYWAYS enough about tht make a new thread for that discussion back on topic :3 its a good idea Omie but there is already sharing ^^ they just keep the timing secret so nobody steals a smaller guilds spawns~ I don't think u meant anything bad about Insanity yourself but some people may have used ur words against u to make it seem like u did and started to make it about flaming insanity instead of discussing ur idea :(

[sufjams]

Also, Echo, I'm against constant guild splintering, as it weakens us. But I want to make a guild with a strong sort of constitution, that in principle is infallible to internal attempts at cheating, and promises everyone the same opportunity. I want to make the America of guilds. :P My main obstacle is that it will seem complicated. But I hope that in the end all the work it requires of members is to participate for points, read the point spreadsheet each week, and bid accordingly.

I believe Insanity is the existing strong guild, and there isn't room for another to try to muscle them out of it. It would be foolish and would just harm the guild attempting as well as Insanity. My goal with the calendar was to let other guilds know how they can get a raid in too. As for my guild, I'm not competing for huge power, only attempting to fill a smaller niche in the Cypion ecosystem.

[master_aiucard]

correct me if i'm wrong but i thought this certain group was given a second chance.

lmao :d

[master_aiucard]

. I want to make the America of guilds.

So whos Obama

[apallday]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought this certain group was given a second chance.

They were, we told unamed guild that there were 4 people who kept being rude to our guild (warring/killing afk people,ksing at male summoning skellies at very end to keep us from getting drops) that we didnt want those people raiding. They said ok we will ban them "we want to start over and we dont want people like that in our guild anyway". So we set a trap for them after they told us "they cleaned up guild" and those people were not part of the guild anymore. We said we decided that they would have to earn respect from us again and there wouldnt be any raids "at this time". Wouldnt ya know it those people were back in guild a few hours later. So we were straight up lied to AGAIN. They were just gonna say those people were banned just so they could raid. Once again loseing our trust.

[BloodMage78]

Hey Seph nice sig ;D

[caitcouldchoke]

Ahh, I like Insanity, but you guys need to calm down.
Seriously, Omie is not flaming you at all.
Can't really single out the only strong guild either.
So yeah, calm down guys. <3

But yeah, I support you, Omie.
I'm down for it.
Because I'm not allowed in most guilds, and I'd like a chance at helping to raid.
Only raid I was allowed to be at was the first Malephar raid.

And because I love you.<3

[omnipotentnicky]

No. Our guild banned those members and they were out of the guild for over a week, you avoided us and wouldn't give us the CHANCE to prove we were willing to comply to said agreement. You simply didn't follow up on your part, not the other way around.

[apallday]

No. Our guild banned those members and they were out of the guild for over a week, you avoided us and wouldn't give us the CHANCE to prove we were willing to comply to said agreement. You simply didn't follow up on your part, not the other way around.

Hey we were not the ones that said "we want to clean up our guild" "we dont want those people in our guild" if that was true you wouldnt have added them back now would you have? lol, nice try though

[omnipotentnicky]

Lol, we did clean up our guild to the extent we wanted it. The few members that came back are back because they are friends, and your deal to have them leave was unfair and just dumb.

[undeadgun]

Also, I'm not a control freak. I'm offering to do a bit of community service in this effort. I've never cheated anyone in this game in all the years I've played.

My wife, was being somewhat used. Not happy with it backthen, not happy right now either.

[omni.knight]

Please do chill guys, it was nothing more than his modest request :) please let's discuss this rationally. we all know each other , no need to point guns ^^

[kitsune_udon]

Interesting thread, but how does this benefit OutSpark? Drama is necessary to start wars to promote the spending of more money on sparkcash items in a never ending cycle.

[BloodMage78]

Interesting thread, but how does this benefit OutSpark? Drama is necessary to start wars to promote the spending of more money on sparkcash items in a never ending cycle.

Lol so true.

[undeadgun]

I have nothing against the idea, I am actually curious to see how is going to turn out. I am usually the one who make arrangement with other guilds leaders for their raid time. We have given every single guild have came to us asking for raid a fair chance. Not one deny. Though, AAO in this very case is an exception, because the deal was broken by themselves. And do trust me, its not easy to make everyone happy, and I am sick of it after the new lair introduced to the game. Do what you have to do omie, even though I dont like what you have done to yuki, I still believe you can be a good leader.
<3 Yukik0, <3 Insanity

[missskita7]

*o* omg Echo, your siggy rocks!

<333333 Insanity Pride 4life!

[BloodMage78]

*o* omg Echo, your siggy rocks!

<333333 Insanity Pride 4life!

Thanks Anna ^^
Insanity 4 Life yo :cool:

[Krystlefied]

:o i love it ec. <3 you honey ^^

[caitcouldchoke]

I have nothing against the idea, I am actually curious to see how is going to turn out. I am usually the one who make arrangement with other guilds leaders for their raid time. We have given every single guild have came to us asking for raid a fair chance. Not one deny. Though, AAO in this very case is an exception, because the deal was broken by themselves. And do trust me, its not easy to make everyone happy, and I am sick of it after the new lair introduced to the game. Do what you have to do omie, even though I dont like what you have done to yuki, I still believe you can be a good leader.
<3 Yukik0, <3 Insanity

Frosty, I come to you to ask for raid time.
I'ma solo Malephar, but I demand that my Banana(Kiala) crit buff me. :c !

[BloodMage78]

But I want Kianub

[caitcouldchoke]

Gtfo, she's mine and always will be. o;<

[BloodMage78]

I'll fight you for her? 8D

[caitcouldchoke]

I'll lose for her. c;
Banana has been mine since before you even came to Cypion. D;<

Anyway, I really want this to work out.
I've been dying to raid.
Sucks when you're not allowed to. :c
Or at least participate but not allowed to get anything.
wompwomp

[BloodMage78]

I've been on Cyp for 6 months :D

[DarkZombie]

Gtfo, She's mine and abi's. Everyone knows that! Love our librarian kia <3

oh what was this thread about D: sorry QQ

[caitcouldchoke]

I've been on Cyp for 6 months :D
Add like 4 or 5 months on to that.
That's how long she's been my Banana.

Gtfo, She's mine and abi's. Everyone knows that! Love our librarian kia <3

oh what was this thread about D: sorry QQ
You gtfo.

[sufjams]

Well, check out the Aequitas guild post in 'Guild Hall.'

It's a synopsis of the guild, with its MO and basic tenants. Feedback is appreciated. Thanks for the replies.

[master_aiucard]

Hey Seph nice sig ;D

<3 someone Epic made it

[master_aiucard]

They were, we told unamed guild that there were 4 people who kept being rude to our guild (warring/killing afk people,ksing at male summoning skellies at very end to keep us from getting drops) that we didnt want those people raiding. They said ok we will ban them "we want to start over and we dont want people like that in our guild anyway". So we set a trap for them after they told us "they cleaned up guild" and those people were not part of the guild anymore. We said we decided that they would have to earn respect from us again and there wouldnt be any raids "at this time". Wouldnt ya know it those people were back in guild a few hours later. So we were straight up lied to AGAIN. They were just gonna say those people were banned just so they could raid. Once again loseing our trust.

LMAO I was out for 2 weeks is that a few hours in your world


I don't see why you guys fear me getting 105's im only 1 person

The person who happens to be the savior of this server

[LongshotFoxx]

This is a nice idea. Too bad there is no way possible to punish guilds that don't obey your rules.

Seriously, I can see all the work you put into this calendar idea, but there is just no way it's gonna happen. This game is based on free market, not on making it "fair" for everyone. I think the economy works fine the way it is.

We don't need to make the game "fair" when it already is.

[apallday]

I'll lose for her. c;
Banana has been mine since before you even came to Cypion. D;<

Anyway, I really want this to work out.
I've been dying to raid.
Sucks when you're not allowed to. :c
Or at least participate but not allowed to get anything.
wompwomp

What is it that you want to work out? if you have 105 players in your guild then just ask us for raid? Also we never said to anyone that "your not allowed to raid" your welcome to bring a dmg prty like other severs do and give it a licking.

[altarcazar2]

really? lmao, omg im laughing so hard i cant breath. Solo our guild? you mean kill afk people that were vending then warp away when theres a fight? Ya if you think thats something to be proud of then yep he whooped our butts he totally spanked each and every one of us.

See omie? this is exactly why we dont let certain people/guilds raid. What do you think would happen if this person was to obtain a 105 weapon? He would run around from town to town screaming how epic he is and how no one could ever be better then him. Tell me omie how is that gonna mke the sever a better place?

Hmm.. Sounds like your violating TOS, Wont let us?

[altarcazar2]

Look, we followed a leader just as your guild does. We did what he told us to do because he was in control of discussions with YOUR guild. HE is no longer a part of this guild or this game. Stop holding others back and allow them to play the game and have fun. Let them on the list to have a few mal raids.

I wonder when people will stop acting like they own things and control and punish people for the problems of 2 people.

[apallday]

LMAO I was out for 2 weeks is that a few hours in your world


I don't see why you guys fear me getting 105's im only 1 person

The person who happens to be the savior of this server

Savior oh praise thee please forgive me for my sin's. The only reason anyone even puts up with you is because of your wallet. Easy to see that you dont mind being used, but the rest of us have true friends that we dont have to buy, oh savior.

[apallday]

Hmm.. Sounds like your violating TOS, Wont let us?

Violating tos? im sry let me rephase the question WE WONT LET YOU DO MOST DMG. I said it b4 and i will say it again, bring a prty of your best people we will bring our prty and we can have 1 big shin-dig and see what happens.

On a side note its funny how you hide behind a noob account,not man enough to own up to what you post?

[caitcouldchoke]

What is it that you want to work out? if you have 105 players in your guild then just ask us for raid? Also we never said to anyone that "your not allowed to raid" your welcome to bring a dmg prty like other severs do and give it a licking.

The only guild and academy I'm in is OWA, aka me and Replica as the only active members.
So, I'm talking about particularly me being able to raid.
I've asked Insanity if I could raid with you guys, never got an answer.
I've asked AAO if I could help raid, said yes but never let me know when there were raids.
And I KNOW I'm not allowed to raid.
I've showed up to try and help with raids in the past, but I either got *****ed at or never got a party.
Besides, guilds usually don't want others raiding with their guild (even if they're cookied like I was/would be if asked), and they don't like temporary members, which is why I said earlier I'm not allowed in most guilds.

It's not really a complaint, it's more of me just really wanting a chance to get something nice. c:

[altarcazar2]

Violating tos? im sry let me rephase the question WE WONT LET YOU DO MOST DMG. I said it b4 and i will say it again, bring a prty of your best people we will bring our prty and we can have 1 big shin-dig and see what happens.

On a side note its funny how you hide behind a noob account,not man enough to own up to what you post?

LOL Noob account? Umm no likely, you just dont know who I am. I dont do stupid sigs and dont need to post my name..

btw, you already stated in your post you won't ALLOW us a raid because of the bad deals you had with a previous guild master. There is a new master with new policy for its members. And I'm pretty sure there hasn't been any issues since this has taken place. Maybe grow up and speak with them a little and work out a tad bit of raid time.

Stop punishing the masses for the issues of a few.

And as far as showing up to KS for this so called shin dig, we won't be a part of such things. New policy is to stear clear and be nice. Fighting never gets anyone anywhere.

Nuff said

[apallday]

The only guild and academy I'm in is OWA, aka me and Replica as the only active members.
So, I'm talking about particularly me being able to raid.
I've asked Insanity if I could raid with you guys, never got an answer.
I've asked AAO if I could help raid, said yes but never let me know when there were raids.
And I KNOW I'm not allowed to raid.
I've showed up to try and help with raids in the past, but I either got *****ed at or never got a party.
Besides, guilds usually don't want others raiding with their guild (even if they're cookied like I was/would be if asked), and they don't like temporary members, which is why I said earlier I'm not allowed in most guilds.

It's not really a complaint, it's more of me just really wanting a chance to get something nice. c:

I dont wanna speak for everyone but im 99% sure no one will mind if you help raid. Just know we have a dmg prty that we use and its unlikely you will benifit from raiding. But if its just to raid and participate in more then just a grindfest im sure no one will mind.

[apallday]

LOL Noob account? Umm no likely, you just dont know who I am. I dont do stupid sigs and dont need to post my name..

btw, you already stated in your post you won't ALLOW us a raid because of the bad deals you had with a previous guild master. There is a new master with new policy for its members. And I'm pretty sure there hasn't been any issues since this has taken place. Maybe grow up and speak with them a little and work out a tad bit of raid time.

Stop punishing the masses for the issues of a few.

And as far as showing up to KS for this so called shin dig, we won't be a part of such things. New policy is to stear clear and be nice. Fighting never gets anyone anywhere.

Nuff said

with all your members posting here and making it known how awfull of people we are, the comments that have been made. Do you honestly feel your earning our respect back? No I mean really do you? Because you and the others posting are just proving us right. Instead of telling us to grow up, how about doing it yourself and proving to others your better then the people who stabbed us in the back?

[altarcazar2]

with all your members posting here and making it known how awfull of people we are, the comments that have been made. Do you honestly feel your earning our respect back? No I mean really do you? Because you and the others posting are just proving us right. Instead of telling us to grow up, how about doing it yourself and proving to others your better then the people who stabbed us in the back?

Umm.. I don't remember saying your a jerk or how awful insanity is. Its just bad that you won't 'allow' AAO to be a part of mal raids or any guild that isn't brown nosing or whatever it is that gets them on your list. Simply give us 1 harpy every 2-3 days as we have asked for repeated times.. No one has slammed you, we are wanting to fix things that horribly went wrong under the leadership of someone that is no longer a part of this game.

[altarcazar2]

They were, we told unamed guild that there were 4 people who kept being rude to our guild (warring/killing afk people,ksing at male summoning skellies at very end to keep us from getting drops) that we didnt want those people raiding. They said ok we will ban them "we want to start over and we dont want people like that in our guild anyway". So we set a trap for them after they told us "they cleaned up guild" and those people were not part of the guild anymore. We said we decided that they would have to earn respect from us again and there wouldnt be any raids "at this time". Wouldnt ya know it those people were back in guild a few hours later. So we were straight up lied to AGAIN. They were just gonna say those people were banned just so they could raid. Once again loseing our trust.

Spit it out, who we talking about here. MrOrbit, Seph, who else? Mai Chai or whatever her name is LOL

[omni.knight]

The only guild and academy I'm in is OWA, aka me and Replica as the only active members.
So, I'm talking about particularly me being able to raid.
I've asked Insanity if I could raid with you guys, never got an answer.
I've asked AAO if I could help raid, said yes but never let me know when there were raids.
And I KNOW I'm not allowed to raid.
I've showed up to try and help with raids in the past, but I either got *****ed at or never got a party.
Besides, guilds usually don't want others raiding with their guild (even if they're cookied like I was/would be if asked), and they don't like temporary members, which is why I said earlier I'm not allowed in most guilds.

It's not really a complaint, it's more of me just really wanting a chance to get something nice. c:

I still <3 you cait :]

[Michelle_Aerro]

Please do chill guys, it was nothing more than his modest request :) please let's discuss this rationally. we all know each other , no need to point guns ^^

I think it is time to point guns, buy potions, charms of might, and what ever else you need. Meet in on Elderine behind OX Field and have an old fashond gun fight. Than we can nail Sephiroth to a post and put him on display so we will be saved.

[Michelle_Aerro]

I think it is time to point guns, buy potions, charms of might, and what ever else you need. Meet in on Elderine behind OX Field and have an old fashond gun fight. Than we can nail Sephiroth to a post and put him on display so we will be saved.

I have gone to Pey in Roumen (cause I know you power leveled noobs don't her or where she is) and I bought a hammer and nails, someone else will need to bring a post.

[apallday]

Spit it out, who we talking about here. MrOrbit, Seph, who else? Mai Chai or whatever her name is LOL

Now that I know who you are I will direct this at you. You were there when you guys broke the deal you were apart of ruining this. Its not 1 person that we are talking about. I have looked at the ss's i have and anyone that that was there was doing it on there own, regaurdless of what your gm told you. You know it was wrong and you did it anyway so its on all of you.

And no one is brown nosing as you say. We are a very faithfull bunch of people. We never wanted this to happen. We were all about keeping the peace untill we were did wrong. So the guilds that raid are the guilds that are respectfull to the game. Not a bunch of people who think they can do whatever they want.

[Michelle_Aerro]

Now that I know who you are I will direct this at you. You were there when you guys broke the deal you were apart of ruining this. Its not 1 person that we are talking about. I have looked at the ss's i have and anyone that that was there was doing it on there own, regaurdless of what your gm told you. You know it was wrong and you did it anyway so its on all of you.

And no one is brown nosing as you say. We are a very faithfull bunch of people. We never wanted this to happen. We were all about keeping the peace untill we were did wrong. So the guilds that raid are the guilds that are respectfull to the game. Not a bunch of people who think they can do whatever they want.

Arn't you just a bunch of people doing whatever you want?

[altarcazar2]

Amen.. They do what they want it seems.

[coldstone]

i have refrained from posting in this matter until i have listened and read both sides, i respectfully submit this to the greater public of cypion, and I STATE that these are MY OPINIONS on that matter, i do not have a stake in the matter personally until my cleric levels past the point he is at now but in my eyes it is quite pathetic to see a few ruin it for everyone with their actions. and i sincerely hope that an out spark employee brings this to the attention of everyone, i'd much rather have no malphbor at all then have 1 unfair power in place.
1. tos clearly states that you shall not form any group or monopolization ring or even talk about any bug that when utilized can cause a player / players / guild / set of players to benefit or otherwise gain an unfair advantage in the game:
A. as such this monopolization and yes it is a monopolization via insanity setting up raid times/schedule and otherwise ks'ing (excuse me) out damaging another guild not on their approved raid times/schedule for the drop is a sign of this monopolization on malph, and as such can be construed as a monopolization ring for the unfair advantage of 105 blues and oranges, having been at several raids where insanity has appeared to out damage the guild(s) i've been with.
2. no person(s) shall intimidate, harass, or other wise keep another player from enjoying the full service of fiesta or of any outspark game or site.
B. in this regard insanity having a 'black list' of who THEY will allow to raid or get a drop from malph or helga clearly shows that they have established a long running monopoly against certain people and have also clearly stated that they intend to harass 1 person and or any guild who doesn't apply to them for a raid time and or isn't cleared by them to get a drop
3. no person(s) may act on behalf or attempt to act on behalf of OutSpark in an official capacity except those whom outspark employs for such purposes (i.e GM's CSR and so forth,)
C, by setting up a private raid schedule, and dictating that you must apply to an Insanity admin to enjoy malphbor raids provided you meet their criteria and are not on their "black list" (see above post), Insanity as a whole is acting in opposition of this ToS rule
Sincerely
Holy Knight Shi_B_A_Desh

[morgain_lefay]

that was so hot i almost peed myself

[apallday]

i have refrained from posting in this matter until i have listened and read both sides, i respectfully submit this to the greater public of cypion, and I STATE that these are MY OPINIONS on that matter, i do not have a stake in the matter personally until my cleric levels past the point he is at now but in my eyes it is quite pathetic to see a few ruin it for everyone with their actions. and i sincerely hope that an out spark employee brings this to the attention of everyone, i'd much rather have no malphbor at all then have 1 unfair power in place.
1. tos clearly states that you shall not form any group or monopolization ring or even talk about any bug that when utilized can cause a player / players / guild / set of players to benefit or otherwise gain an unfair advantage in the game:
A. as such this monopolization and yes it is a monopolization via insanity setting up raid times/schedule and otherwise ks'ing (excuse me) out damaging another guild not on their approved raid times/schedule for the drop is a sign of this monopolization on malph, and as such can be construed as a monopolization ring for the unfair advantage of 105 blues and oranges, having been at several raids where insanity has appeared to out damage the guild(s) i've been with.
2. no person(s) shall intimidate, harass, or other wise keep another player from enjoying the full service of fiesta or of any outspark game or site.
B. in this regard insanity having a 'black list' of who THEY will allow to raid or get a drop from malph or helga clearly shows that they have established a long running monopoly against certain people and have also clearly stated that they intend to harass 1 person and or any guild who doesn't apply to them for a raid time and or isn't cleared by them to get a drop
3. no person(s) may act on behalf or attempt to act on behalf of OutSpark in an official capacity except those whom outspark employs for such purposes (i.e GM's CSR and so forth,)
C, by setting up a private raid schedule, and dictating that you must apply to an Insanity admin to enjoy malphbor raids provided you meet their criteria and are not on their "black list" (see above post), Insanity as a whole is acting in opposition of this ToS rule
Sincerely
Holy Knight Shi_B_A_Desh

well all this is right exept the fact that we never said people are not allowed to raid. i said it 10 times as a matter of fact. If you wish to raid then show up with a prty and raid. It is our choice if we want to raid at the same time. It is our choice if we chose not to raid at a certain time.

It is also not our fault that oos designed it like this. I have posted many time that there should be 4 or 5 different males/harpies like a normal dungen. then every guild can have there own but this is the way os or oos likes it so this is how we do it.

[Michelle_Aerro]

Last Word (I just had to get that in)

[morgain_lefay]

Sorry to step over ya michellle, ok im not, the problem being yeah insanity says get your guild and do a raid, if they want to join in they will if they dont they wont, the fact somone can think that they will join when they want to join is a bit appauling, and easily shown as a means of ks'ing people that are not liked or even "black listed" as said, on a lighter note yayyyy i gotta ghetto siggy for now hehe

[coldstone]

yes that is true but by acting in the manner that insanity has acted they have caused the entirety of the situation and you can not Deny it now, your own guild master(s) have clearly stated it as such if you don't believe me then go and read their posts of earlier, and by acting in the manner described in my post you have formed a monopolization ring and as such well lol you can't say you can come to a raid if you like when you've already gotten about a months worth of what i'll term illegal 105 and before that using electro shock to glitch helga so that you obtained around 14 helgaits putting you in a better position to construct this particular fisaco, i'd be very damn glad no one has brought to the attention of O.S or OOS the problems Insanity has caused thus far, I wouldn't be surprised to see permanent bans handed out like xmas candy and the dissolution of insanity as a guild and the removal of all your ill gotten gains being used as fair recomprise for the knowledgable formation of this bull marlarky that you empathize wasn't your fault :3 grow up the law doesn't accept i didn't know it was illegal as an excuse!

[dutchboy.h2]

I seem to remeber a thread just like this when helga came out xD, sorry for the off topicness can't really remember if it was on epith or cypion it involved a lot of drama too :I

[morgain_lefay]

Really its sad that the drama like this occurs, then again from whats been brought to my attention most other servers dont have the problem we have on Cypion, that most guilds are pretty equal to eachother and i think thats a good thing, problem is here as Shi_B_A_Desh has mentioned is that yes it is a monopoly and it is being done unfairly to all and from what ive seen the only people who dont have a problem with it are either in insanity themselves or someone allied to them, final thoughts are just this ....

Insanity your the best on the server *tosses cookies to all* why not give up the reigns for a while and see who else could team up and get to your standards since through these raids you gain all the best gears which then in turn never get to any of us poor common folk *rolls eyes*, or does it really come down to something fear based? worried a power struggle might arise and you wont be the best anymore? ....just remember took a thousand years but even the romans were brought down....

none of that was meant as an insult, just simply food for thought ...BTW i havent heard from our savior in a while, sephiroth you always make me giggle hehe

[el_cabron]

A few didnt ruin it for everyone. A few ruined it for a few. You know who you are. Your accusations are false. We have never acted outside the boundaries of the ToS. Nothing has been obtained illegally. (lol) Dont be sore about it because you were part of the few that were disrespectful towards others. We happily share with ppl who are honest and have respect for all.

[BloodMage78]

yes that is true but by acting in the manner that insanity has acted they have caused the entirety of the situation and you can not Deny it now, your own guild master(s) have clearly stated it as such if you don't believe me then go and read their posts of earlier, and by acting in the manner described in my post you have formed a monopolization ring and as such well lol you can't say you can come to a raid if you like when you've already gotten about a months worth of what i'll term illegal 105 and before that using electro shock to glitch helga so that you obtained around 14 helgaits putting you in a better position to construct this particular fisaco, i'd be very damn glad no one has brought to the attention of O.S or OOS the problems Insanity has caused thus far, I wouldn't be surprised to see permanent bans handed out like xmas candy and the dissolution of insanity as a guild and the removal of all your ill gotten gains being used as fair recomprise for the knowledgable formation of this bull marlarky that you empathize wasn't your fault :3 grow up the law doesn't accept i didn't know it was illegal as an excuse!

Illegal 105s? So all the money I've spent on charms and w/e else I'm wearing makes them illegal? We've obtained all our items fair and square and the server knows that. The people who believe otherwise are just jealous because they aren't getting anything from it.

And electric shock wasn't just Cypion. Other servers were using it as well. Here's a link of other players from different servers questioning why it isn't working anymore.
[Link] (http://www.outspark.com/forums/showthread.php?t=273649&)
So if you think everyone who has a hg from the electric shock thing should be banned I don't know what you're on. High on jealousy maybe?

On a side note, Insanity get's all this bs thrown at us because we are on top. I've played on 2 other servers (Apoline and Legel) and I can tell you the top guild on any server has to deal with the most bs. However true or untrue. Why? Cause their they easiest targets to blame.

[coldstone]

a few (out side of insanity) acted on their own accord which is with in their rights to do as they please as long as it doesn't break tos. you leopold stotch on the other hand have formed either unwilling, unwittingly, or worse yet Knowingly a monopolization ring and it is your head most of that will hit the chopping block from insanity. as for what is illegal and not illegal here let me explain, it was a term I, Myself have used, whether it was illegal is not up to me to decide, and yes we know you glitched helga it has been common knowledge on the server since you started raids, more then 1 person has admitted to glitching helga. on to the next point; how you choose to "blacklist" other guilds or person(s) is none of my concern because i merely observe this situation and am adding my comments, you even now are saying your black listing a (few) people, you've said it in every post that you've put up, either obvious or in reference to . do not deny anything leopold stotch, it is much much too late to deny it. again grow up the law (tos) in this case doesn't support you, these are not accusations anymore they have grown beyond that scope and are now full blown charges, to which you can deny all you like but the truth does remain and it is common knowledge to everyone on this server who is at least past sixty obviously since le fay morgan is able to comment upon these matters in a clear manner. Sincerely Shiba

[coldstone]

@ echo, i'd like to say 1 thing, you spent that money in the hopes of obtaining blues like everyone else did but you did it in a manner that went against terms of service how ever that may be that merely states that yes they were illegal, also just because others join you in making a mistake doesn't mean your approved for making that mistake, the helga glitch was a regrettable oversight. i dont' think they should be banned i merely use it as an example to what wouldn't be a suprise to me you need to read it more throughly and clearly. also congrats on being in a top guild on 3 servers? it doesnt' have any weight here, no one is throwing b.s. at you no one is attacking you personally we are merely reviewing what appears to be a monopolization ring effort on the behalf of insanity. please keep your accusations of jealousy to yourself i have no part in this beyond observer sure i'd love to get a blue but what ever it matters little to me in the long run they are merely icing on a cake. sincerely Shiba

[obson90]

Honestly i dont think this will work -.-
Like the OP said were like animals, and animals in a pack will eventually kill the alpha male (insanity)
Also there is no way the honor code can ever work on the internet :/

[missskita7]

ShibaDesh you need to stop talking about illegal actions--since you like to solicit sexual favors from minors (14-16year olds) --and I have screenshots from gamers that have come to me for help from you! And I have made sure they know how to report you. So, stop acting so high and mighty! I will not DARE listen to someone who is so filthy in real life!


As for the Drama going on---yes it is undeniable--we are at the top. But we don't harrass other people or guilds. We don't go around warring lower level guilds, or ksing at mimics like some of you guys do for fun. Stop spreading such horrible lies--and imprinting us as the EVIL... if I remember correctly OWA also was the EVIL, then it was Legacy... Everyone just likes to bring down who is on top because we are an easy target--just like Echo said.

This whole thread is a complete FLAME to bring us down, and it has been made apparent and the FALSE way it began has revealed it self with the OS monopolization argument. We are not going to let your pretty words cloud us, when your intentions were to knife us and bring us down.

Why!! is it so important that we all go down? You know you wont be the best guild, because in my opinion No-Drama is the 2nd most powerful guild. Will you attack them next?

[el_cabron]

I dont know where youre getting this monopolization idea. Insanity is not monoploizing the malephar raids. All respectable guilds are getting their fair share of raids and have obtained 105 blues. We are not the only guild that has 105 male blues.

[coldstone]

@ annaseylia you had best bring proof to your libel, because if your gonna talk to me in such a manner when you DARE to sling mud isn't my concern, nor is the basically flame post you aimed at me just now my concern nor is it the CONCERN of the matter at hand.
also you didn't blacklist guilds or people on purpose? but it happened didn't it? and because it happened your denial that you weren't doing it on purpose or knowingly, isn't an excuse in the law and your own posts prove it.
edit- by libel i mean accusations or lies in this case, also if you do post anything of that nature on here i can and will report you for true blacklisting... go ahead i DARE you to be so stupid. on another note get over it you couldn't beat my mage when we were 85 together big deal your a fail strenght cleric now and you probally will remain so. -off topic-

[coldstone]

you say it again respectable but you continue to ks every guild you deem unworthy and you've said it before that you need to be informed through application and a worthy process to see if a guild can share time with you. that is where we are getting it.

[el_cabron]

Lol theres no proccess. just ask and we share. And theres no "black listing" going on to my knowledge. I just prefer not to share with rude, disrespectful ppl. Is that too hard for you to understand?

[BloodMage78]

Double posting is against Forum rules btw. There's this thing called an edit button.


@ echo, i'd like to say 1 thing, you spent that money in the hopes of obtaining blues like everyone else did but you did it in a manner that went against terms of service how ever that may be that merely states that yes they were illegal, also just because others join you in making a mistake doesn't mean your approved for making that mistake, the helga glitch was a regrettable oversight. i dont' think they should be banned i merely use it as an example to what wouldn't be a suprise to me you need to read it more throughly and clearly.

How did I or my guild obtain anything illegally? It's as simple as killing a monster and getting a drop. Please tell me how killing a monster for a drop is against the Terms of Service. I should be banned at level 1 for killing a slime then.

In regards to the electric shock "glitch", how is this illegal? Go read the link I posted. No official Outspark staff said it was illegal. Also, it's a skill in game that does DAMAGE. So were not allowed to use a single skill to cause damage to a monster?


also congrats on being in a top guild on 3 servers? it doesnt' have any weight here, no one is throwing b.s. at you no one is attacking you personally we are merely reviewing what appears to be a monopolization ring effort on the behalf of insanity.

I'm merely stating that any top ranked guild on any server deals with the most b.s. You totally overlooked the main point as to why I posted it.


please keep your accusations of jealousy to yourself i have no part in this beyond observer sure i'd love to get a blue but what ever it matters little to me in the long run they are merely icing on a cake. sincerely Shiba

Why else are you upset then? Other people have 105 blues, other guilds raid male. I don't see any reason to argue other than that your jealous.

Edit:
Here's the link on electric shock and Helga, I'll post it again for you. [Link] (http://www.outspark.com/forums/showthread.php?t=273649&)

[coldstone]

goes and gets quotes from leo, "that person shall never get a 105", "what do you think they would be like if they got a 105?" quote taken from mr orbitz while conducting business with you to "share" " your not allowed to have seph aka the savior in AAO if you want to raid" hmm looks like black listing of AAO and seph right there. how you define that and how you act are realllllllllllllyyyyyyyyyyyy different.

edit to echo, let me be clear, it is as simple as getting a drop WHEN you are acting in accord with tos WHEN you form an illegal racket to monopolize a spot, area or what have you then you are at fault,
the Helga Glitch is just that a 'glitch" and there for illegal by terms of service
i am not upset i am merely putting out to cypion my opinions on the matter your the one who's accusing me of being jealous here and frankly meh, the issue concerns me i have stated why i'd rather not have malph at all. and the only reason it's an issue now is because you and others in insanity see it as what it is. the truth. so your trying to quash it.

[master_aiucard]

I just got to say it shows how epic i am if a whole guild is in fear of me getting stronger

your all going to miss me once I cap



If you could make God bleed, people will cease to believe in Him

[BloodMage78]

edit to echo, let me be clear, it is as simple as getting a drop WHEN you are acting in accord with tos WHEN you form an illegal racket to monopolize a spot, area or what have you then you are at fault,
the Helga Glitch is just that a 'glitch" and there for illegal by terms of service
i am not upset i am merely putting out to cypion my opinions on the matter your the one who's accusing me of being jealous here and frankly meh, the issue concerns me i have stated why i'd rather not have malph at all. and the only reason it's an issue now is because you and others in insanity see it as what it is. the truth. so your trying to quash it.

Again, who's monopolizing a spot? Other guilds have spawns, other guilds have drops.

Read the link plawks [Link] (http://www.outspark.com/forums/showthread.php?t=273649&)
Cypion wasn't the only server that noticed this skills effect. And glitches are only a bannable offense when players exploit them. With that said officials usually post something on exploiting glitches on the forums yet they didn't say it was on the thread I'm referring too. So yeah, no one was exploiting the skill.

[omnipotentnicky]

Really? If all are fairly allowed to raid, then please tell me this. Why did you bother us when we were attempting to raid ONE SINGLE Harpy after maintenance? There were few of us there, not to mention you could have chosen the other Harpy to spawn because you had a few more members there than we did. So please, inform me and all others reading this, why you decided to ruin it for us when we were there first, not bothering you and yours, or even saying one single thing about you at the time?

You did it, because you feel like you can do whatever you want. Like you can push around anyone you want. For you to even try to make what you did acceptable, there is something wrong with the way that silly brain of yours functions.

[coldstone]

the other guilds have them because they're how did he put it respectful acceptable guilds who've applied to Isanity for raid times which is discussed in my first post and how that would be seen as a violation of tos, yeah that shop insanity put up on malph's lair is just making you look idiotic when you say stuff regarding it echo do stop now please before you dig yourself too far in there LOL how do we know what OS will choose to do or not do in regards to punishment what i am saying is that Insanity used it as a glitch to gain an unfair advantage and your not even denying it that right there has got to be against something i know what its against but i'm starting to sound worn out here repeating my arguments.

[morgain_lefay]

If you could make God bleed, people will cease to believe in Him

that was just hot sephiroth .....new status for FB FTW

[tintin1]

lets all be friends =)

[coldstone]

i concur toniku lets move past these appalling problems and be friends <3 community and values that don't include they have to do die because they said they wanted my spot lol

[JOHNNYPOOPOOPANTS]

I've been reading this thread and watching Cypion since it began and always wanted a peaceful, friendly server. Fighting over Helga, grind spots, Malephar - these are things that have caused unnecessary drama. In addition to my financial situation, the state of bickering and drama on Cypion led me to permanently retire my prestiges. Finalizer even mocked how I spend my time on low levels. (We're cool now though.)

I'd love to bring back my Knight but I simply can't do it since I can't stand the fighting. I know that might sound hypocritical of me, but I've taken a step back and looked at how things are.

Hopefully you all will work this out and Cypion will be nice to play on. Maybe one day I can bring Eric the fail dex fighter back but until then I'll be watching from my nubs.

[omnipotentnicky]

Lolol @ Dexican Archer. But yeah, quitting your prestige makes sense, I've seen many others quit for this very reason. ><

[coldstone]

i concur eric, we've been enemies for ages but let me turn and offer a handshake of peace, if you ever need a buff please don't hesitate to ask me.

[Krystlefied]

Ok I think everyone's just thinking about this too much, let's just all forget about this issue and be friends. In the first place this thread was all about establishing peace and whatnot, and now we have people arguing over raid times. For me I think, ever since I joined Insanity, they've been awesome, even though there are some members who have caused some problems overall. But hey, no one's perfect, everyone has their own flaws, so if you think about it's just a matter of dealing with all the imperfections that everyone has and get along with each other.

Period.

<-- Yukik0 btw :P

[JOHNNYPOOPOOPANTS]

Lolol @ Dexican Archer. But yeah, quitting your prestige makes sense, I've seen many others quit for this very reason. ><

Don't use lol in reference to my Dexican JAJAJA. You must say jajajajajaja.


i concur eric, we've been enemies for ages but let me turn and offer a handshake of peace, if you ever need a buff please don't hesitate to ask me.

Rofl we've hated each other since the first week of Cypion. Good times. And buff plz.

[morgain_lefay]

i stick to my original post, i dont know why anyones worried, ima keel chu all anyways ^_^

[Michelle_Aerro]

Really its sad that the drama like this occurs, then again from whats been brought to my attention most other servers dont have the problem we have on Cypion, that most guilds are pretty equal to eachother and i think thats a good thing, problem is here as Shi_B_A_Desh has mentioned is that yes it is a monopoly and it is being done unfairly to all and from what ive seen the only people who dont have a problem with it are either in insanity themselves or someone allied to them



I am just a NOOB (and proud to be) at all this, but I think it is clear to see if you step back and look at it again. Cypion has problems like this cause it must be the newest server, and all the undesirable people from other servers came here. They all have ganged up and power leveled and took over. This is the first server I played on and I am proud to be a part of it no matter how small and insignificant a part. This is the best server for new players to start out on from what I have done. I am on all six servers and have a guild on all of them (Cypion is only active one for now). Maybe you all should all go back to whatever server you came here from, Cypion does not have this kind of problems in the lower levels. When we go in the Tower we party with anyone (not just my guild) and I personally will leave alot of drops for other guilds members. When I do get a new weapon or armor that I already have I just keep the one with better stats. I will sell what I don't need, or give it away cause I don't like to waste time in store.

Quote: Can we all get along? - Rodney King

[omnipotentnicky]

Jajajajajajajajaja.

Yuki, that's awesome.. Are you the only one in Insanity offering to do such, tho?

[master_aiucard]

that was just hot sephiroth .....new status for FB FTW

O dont do that insanity will put you on the black list with me

[master_aiucard]

I am happy to join with you today in what will go down in history as the greatest demonstration for freedom in the history of our nation.

Five score years ago, a great American, in whose symbolic shadow we stand, signed the Emancipation Proclamation. This momentous decree came as a great beacon light of hope to millions of Negro slaves, who had been seared in the flames of withering injustice. It came as a joyous daybreak to end the long night of captivity. But one hundred years later, we must face the tragic fact that the Negro is still not free. One hundred years later, the life of the Negro is still sadly crippled by the manacles of segregation and the chains of discrimination.

One hundred years later, the Negro lives on a lonely island of poverty in the midst of a vast ocean of material prosperity. One hundred years later, the Negro is still languishing in the corners of American society and finds himself an exile in his own land. So we have come here today to dramatize an appalling condition.

In a sense we have come to our nation�s Capital to cash a check. When the architects of our republic wrote the magnificent words of the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence, they were signing a promissory note to which every American was to fall heir.

This note was a promise that all men would be guaranteed the inalienable rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

It is obvious today that America has defaulted on this promissory note insofar as her citizens of color are concerned. Instead of honoring this sacred obligation, America has given the Negro a bad check, a check which has come back marked "insufficient funds."

But we refuse to believe that the bank of justice is bankrupt. We refuse to believe that there are insufficient funds in the great vaults of opportunity of this nation. So we have come to cash this check, a check that will give us upon demand the riches of freedom and the security of justice.

We have also come to this hallowed spot to remind America of the fierce urgency of Now. This is no time to engage in the luxury of cooling off or to take the tranquilizing drug of gradualism.

Now is the time to make real the promises of democracy.

Now is the time to rise from the dark and desolate valley of segregation to the sunlit path of racial justice.

Now is the time to open the doors of opportunity to all God�s children.

Now is the time to lift our nation from the quicksands of racial injustice to the solid rock of brotherhood.

It would be fatal for the nation to overlook the urgency of the moment and to underestimate the determination of the Negro. This sweltering summer of the Negro�s legitimate discontent will not pass until there is an invigorating autumn of freedom and equality. Nineteen sixty-three is not an end but a beginning. Those who hope that the Negro needed to blow off steam and will now be content will have a rude awakening if the nation returns to business as usual.

There will be neither rest nor tranquility in America until the Negro is granted his citizenship rights. The whirlwinds of revolt will continue to shake the foundations of our nation until the bright day of justice emerges.

But there is something that I must say to my people who stand on the warm threshold which leads into the palace of justice. In the process of gaining our rightful place, we must not be guilty of wrong deeds. Let us not seek to satisfy our thirst for freedom by drinking from the cup of bitterness and hatred. We must forever conduct our struggle on the high plane of dignity and discipline. We must not allow our creative protest to degenerate into physical violence. Again and again we must rise to the majestic heights of meeting physical force with soul force. The marvelous new militancy which has engulfed the Negro community must not lead us to a distrust of all white people, for many of our white brothers, as evidenced by their presence here today, have come to realize that their destiny is tied up with our destiny and their freedom is inextricably bound to our freedom. We cannot walk alone.

And as we walk, we must make the pledge that we shall march ahead. We cannot turn back. There are those who are asking the devotees of civil rights, "When will you be satisfied?" We can never be satisfied as long as the Negro is the victim of the unspeakable horrors of police brutality. We can never be satisfied as long as our bodies, heavy with the fatigue of travel, cannot gain lodging in the motels of the highways and the hotels of the cities.

We cannot be satisfied as long as the Negro�s basic mobility is from a smaller ghetto to a larger one.

We cannot be satisfied as long as a Negro in Mississippi cannot vote, and a Negro in New York believes he has nothing for which to vote.

No, no we are not satisfied and we will not be satisfied until justice rolls down like waters and righteousness like a mighty stream.

I am not unmindful that some of you have come here out of great trials and tribulations. Some of you have come fresh from narrow jail cells. Some of you have come from areas where your quest for freedom left you battered by storms of persecutions and staggered by the winds of police brutality. You have been the veterans of creative suffering. Continue to work with the faith that unearned suffering is redemptive.

Go back to Mississippi, go back to Alabama, go back to South Carolina, go back to Georgia, go back to Louisiana, go back to the slums and ghettos of our modern cities, knowing that somehow this situation can and will be changed.

Let us not wallow in the valley of despair. I say to you today, my friends, that in spite of the difficulties and frustrations of the moment, I still have a dream.

It is a dream deeply rooted in the American dream.

I have a dream that one day this nation will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed. "We hold these truths to be self-evident that all men are created equal."

I have a dream that one day out on the red hills of Georgia the sons of former slaves and the sons of former slaveowners will be able to sit down together at the table of brotherhood.

I have a dream that one day even the state of Mississippi, a desert state sweltering with the heat and injustice of oppression, will be transformed into an oasis of freedom and justice.

I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character.

I have a dream today.

I have a dream that one day the state of Alabama, whose governor�s lips are presently dripping with the words of interposition and nullification, will be transformed into a situation where little black boys and black girls will be able to join hands with little white boys and white girls and walk together as sisters and brothers.

I have a dream today.

I have a dream that one day every valley shall be exalted, every hill and mountain shall be made low, the rough places will be made plains and the crooked places will be made straight and the glory of the Lord shall be revealed and all flesh shall see it together.

This is our hope. This is the faith with which I return to the South. With this faith we will be able to hew out of the mountain of despair a stone of hope.

With this faith we will be able to transform the jangling discords of our nation into a beautiful symphony of brotherhood.

With this faith we will be able to work together, to pray together, to struggle together, to go to jail together, to stand up for freedom together, knowing that we will be free one day.

This will be the day when all of God�s children will be able to sing with new meaning "My country �tis of thee, sweet land of liberty, of thee I sing. Land where my fathers died, land of the Pilgrim�s pride, from every mountainside, let freedom ring!"

And if America is to be a great nation, this must become true. So let freedom ring from the prodigious hilltops of New Hampshire. Let freedom ring from the mighty mountains of New York.

Let freedom ring from the heightening Alleghenies of Pennsylvania.

Let freedom ring from the snow-capped Rockies of Colorado.

Let freedom ring from the curvaceous peaks of California.

But not only that, let freedom, ring from Stone Mountain of Georgia.

Let freedom ring from Lookout Mountain of Tennessee.

Let freedom ring from every hill and molehill of Mississippi. From every mountainside, let freedom ring.

When we let freedom ring, when we let it ring from every village and every hamlet, from every state and every city, we will be able to speed up that day when all of God�s children, black men and white men, Jews and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual, "Free at last, free at last. Thank God Almighty, we are free at last."

[morgain_lefay]

I am just a NOOB (and proud to be) at all this, but I think it is clear to see if you step back and look at it again. Cypion has problems like this cause it must be the newest server, and all the undesirable people from other servers came here. They all have ganged up and power leveled and took over. This is the first server I played on and I am proud to be a part of it no matter how small and insignificant a part. This is the best server for new players to start out on from what I have done. I am on all six servers and have a guild on all of them (Cypion is only active one for now). Maybe you all should all go back to whatever server you came here from, Cypion does not have this kind of problems in the lower levels. When we go in the Tower we party with anyone (not just my guild) and I personally will leave alot of drops for other guilds members. When I do get a new weapon or armor that I already have I just keep the one with better stats. I will sell what I don't need, or give it away cause I don't like to waste time in store. my fiesta life was born here on cypion ...ive one other mage on bijou that i barely ever touch


and omg sephiroth again you did not cease to amaze me

[caitcouldchoke]

Seph, I might love you a little more than I already do.

[Michelle_Aerro]

I just got to say it shows how epic i am if a whole guild is in fear of me getting stronger

your all going to miss me once I cap



If you could make God bleed, people will cease to believe in Him

If you could make God bleed, no one would believe you. We would think you were crazy.

[Krystlefied]

pansy: like i said again, no one's perfect so idk if anyone would share the same opinion with me. x.x

[coldstone]

and now let us all join hands and sing free at last, free at last <3 epic post sephy, get on vent.

[DemonBlitzKragor]

Gonna just close this thread 'cause it's turned into a battlefield. x__x If you're ever gonna try and discuss something, try and do it civilly please. ._.

-Closed-