Why Players do what the do...

[Kealm]

Archers: Since i'm an archer myself this is where must start. My main problem is with archers in pvp x.x. In general why do archer stand still when they fight. It's completely dumb. When standing still you open yourself to the following forms of defeat:

Fighters: they get to do the fight how they like it.. stun burn and you dead.

Mages: Nova/inferno becomes usable and the dps they put on you is far more then overwhelming.

Clerics: they can hit you, and you'll run out of hp stones rather quickly.

My pvp strategy is completely based on the ability to attack on the run. I will outline my ways of overcoming the above problems that outline archer pvp.

Fighters: it's a kite by far, not just straight line running, i zig and zag and change directions alot, and as unpredicatably as i can. This is to prevent any sort of sure-win strategy they have, and make them work for it. On top of that the sudden turning throws off anyone who moves by point and click... and i've pwned such people completely and thoroughly doing so. Now the main problem is our wasd users who continue to stay on you like glue, though the constant changing does throw them off some no matter who they are, allowing a few free hits from time to time. I will openly admit there are some insanely tough fighters on top of their game out there. No matter how much i screw up their timing, they still manage to keep me on my edge. Alot of fighters get mad at this sort of pvp, but let me put it straight, i will never give you a free kill unless i'm busy with something else when you do it. You catch me in pvp while i'm active, you WILL work for every bit of it, or you will give up like alot of people do out of frustration.

Mages: Not much changes with mages other then those who use inferno/nova on an archer who is more then willing to move around are wasting precious time. Most mages i can defeat without much problems. There are a few tankers out there, or first gens with very leet gear i can't overcome. Though i hope i've proven a hard target to each and every one of them i've fought seriously.

Clerics: Unlike fighters straight line kiting works much better here. Doesn't matter how good you are, you'll only get to touch me once every 10-20seconds if you're good at keeping up. I've never finished a serious fight with a cleric... they all stop after awhile saying it's pointless. I'm sure some that know me, know i'm completely serious when i say i will keep going till i drain every last sp stone out of you and get the free kill at the end. To bad no one has gone that far with me x.x.

Archers: Um... they can move as well as i do... so moving is pointless... just nuke and laugh about the results at the end ^^.

This is how the end build archer does his pvp. I'm neither the toughest nor the best out there. But i have the intelligence and gear to challenge anyone i want and not just go down without forcing effort.

Fighters: So many things fighters do or don't do out there x.x. Both in pvp and in the field. I won't mention the field and it's major variety in tanking styles. Only thing i have to say about pvp... unless you're cookied why would you ever use a 1hsword and shield... I might understand if you were fighting a mage but other then that... gah it seems so pointless to even mention it. I feel every fighter should have a 2h axe when they march into pvp (unless cookied then it's just to much).

Mages: There are alot of good mages... and alot of bad mages. The difference lays totally in how skills are applied. First off some people spam nova/inferno like it's some sort of life saver... i kill those people alot and laugh to myself about it. That sort of thing help with fighter/clercs, but what on earth is the idea of useing it on an archer or another mage? Both can just meander right on out of it and make all that effort pointless before you finish the animation of using it and can cast your next spell. Second they made some major changes to fear, it used to be great for holding someone in place for the nova/inferno idea... that is no more... when under fear you run around like a chicken with it's head cut off. Sometimes into the aoe sometimes completely out of it. However they did make you unable to use pots/scroll/consumable items during it's affects. Very few mages use chain cast effectively in pvp... it should be used with fear. Since you can now pot in pvp, players like myself who would normally not be a challenge with only stones can now effectively compete in the pvp game. The only way for a mage to 'normally' kill such a player armed to the teeth in pots is by taking away that advantage... though most don't sadly enough for them. There is only one mage who has been able to literally over power me wihtout the use of fear... he knows who he is. The only other way i've ever died to a mage (not counting being in chat or afk so don't go there), is by chain casting fear and nuking the life out of me.

Clerics: No problems in pvp, but one thing that always gets on my nerves, when someone dies in a pull... why on EARTH do you rez them while the party is still mobbed and fighting. About 3/4 of our servers clerics do it... and half the time someone else dies from doing so. I'm capped, idc about xp, idc if i die, thus why i don't put for the effort to maintain hp and just nuke away as fast as i can on the mobs... so why rez me midpull? Another thing... clerics seem to love during duos... when you die... they run to you and then rez you. LoL idk how many people have died doing that because the mobs were dotted and still there to turn on them x.x. But alot have. And of could i have done anyhing i would have... though that litte 'you can't attack or do anythng' green icon right afte rezzing on the buffs area prevents the last second rescue x.x.


And that concludes my rant about bijou's typical pvp and non pvp mistakes that i have found problems with :P. I hope you all have fun argueing about what's a problem and what's not... since i put a major cramp in my hands typing this much in one sitting x.x. Just for my friends in bijou.

[Celtic_Princess]

Most archers don't move in PvP because if they start kiting no one wants to chase them around long enough to fight them.

[Kealm]

Most archers don't move in PvP because if they start kiting no one wants to chase them around long enough to fight them.

That is sad but true. Regardles i won't change my style for anyone unless it's one of those handicapped just for fun matchs ^^. The no-stones-no-healing was very fun to do i enjoyed that one... so unprdicable who would win. And i didn't kite that one, i liked the edge on luck that came with it.

On that note you lazy lazy people! Without kiting pvp is pointless for the majority of my cl@ss, a few exceptions that have been around since the beginning of fiesta... but those are few and far between. I don't hand out free kills you know.

[Celtic_Princess]

lol I agree.....but that still doesn't mean I wanna spend ten minutes chasing you XD

<---admittedly lazy.

Not to mention kiting a cleric is just...pointless. Unless the cleric agrees not to heal. With the heal while running feature...its basically a game of 'see how long it takes to run me out of all 245 sp stones plus whatever pots I have'.

[Farashimisanoob]

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s156/KoolKidsKlub93/160px-Bill_Nye_Expert.jpg

[donkster]

Archers: Since i'm an archer myself this is where must start. My main problem is with archers in pvp x.x. In general why do archer stand still when they fight. It's completely dumb. When standing still you open yourself to the following forms of defeat:

Fighters: they get to do the fight how they like it.. stun burn and you dead.

Mages: Nova/inferno becomes usable and the dps they put on you is far more then overwhelming.

Clerics: they can hit you, and you'll run out of hp stones rather quickly.

My pvp strategy is completely based on the ability to attack on the run. I will outline my ways of overcoming the above problems that outline archer pvp.

Fighters: it's a kite by far, not just straight line running, i zig and zag and change directions alot, and as unpredicatably as i can. This is to prevent any sort of sure-win strategy they have, and make them work for it. On top of that the sudden turning throws off anyone who moves by point and click... and i've pwned such people completely and thoroughly doing so. Now the main problem is our wasd users who continue to stay on you like glue, though the constant changing does throw them off some no matter who they are, allowing a few free hits from time to time. I will openly admit there are some insanely tough fighters on top of their game out there. No matter how much i screw up their timing, they still manage to keep me on my edge. Alot of fighters get mad at this sort of pvp, but let me put it straight, i will never give you a free kill unless i'm busy with something else when you do it. You catch me in pvp while i'm active, you WILL work for every bit of it, or you will give up like alot of people do out of frustration.

Mages: Not much changes with mages other then those who use inferno/nova on an archer who is more then willing to move around are wasting precious time. Most mages i can defeat without much problems. There are a few tankers out there, or first gens with very leet gear i can't overcome. Though i hope i've proven a hard target to each and every one of them i've fought seriously.

Clerics: Unlike fighters straight line kiting works much better here. Doesn't matter how good you are, you'll only get to touch me once every 10-20seconds if you're good at keeping up. I've never finished a serious fight with a cleric... they all stop after awhile saying it's pointless. I'm sure some that know me, know i'm completely serious when i say i will keep going till i drain every last sp stone out of you and get the free kill at the end. To bad no one has gone that far with me x.x.

Archers: Um... they can move as well as i do... so moving is pointless... just nuke and laugh about the results at the end ^^.

This is how the end build archer does his pvp. I'm neither the toughest nor the best out there. But i have the intelligence and gear to challenge anyone i want and not just go down without forcing effort.

Fighters: So many things fighters do or don't do out there x.x. Both in pvp and in the field. I won't mention the field and it's major variety in tanking styles. Only thing i have to say about pvp... unless you're cookied why would you ever use a 1hsword and shield... I might understand if you were fighting a mage but other then that... gah it seems so pointless to even mention it. I feel every fighter should have a 2h axe when they march into pvp (unless cookied then it's just to much).

Mages: There are alot of good mages... and alot of bad mages. The difference lays totally in how skills are applied. First off some people spam nova/inferno like it's some sort of life saver... i kill those people alot and laugh to myself about it. That sort of thing help with fighter/clercs, but what on earth is the idea of useing it on an archer or another mage? Both can just meander right on out of it and make all that effort pointless before you finish the animation of using it and can cast your next spell. Second they made some major changes to fear, it used to be great for holding someone in place for the nova/inferno idea... that is no more... when under fear you run around like a chicken with it's head cut off. Sometimes into the aoe sometimes completely out of it. However they did make you unable to use pots/scroll/consumable items during it's affects. Very few mages use chain cast effectively in pvp... it should be used with fear. Since you can now pot in pvp, players like myself who would normally not be a challenge with only stones can now effectively compete in the pvp game. The only way for a mage to 'normally' kill such a player armed to the teeth in pots is by taking away that advantage... though most don't sadly enough for them. There is only one mage who has been able to literally over power me wihtout the use of fear... he knows who he is. The only other way i've ever died to a mage (not counting being in chat or afk so don't go there), is by chain casting fear and nuking the life out of me.

Clerics: No problems in pvp, but one thing that always gets on my nerves, when someone dies in a pull... why on EARTH do you rez them while the party is still mobbed and fighting. About 3/4 of our servers clerics do it... and half the time someone else dies from doing so. I'm capped, idc about xp, idc if i die, thus why i don't put for the effort to maintain hp and just nuke away as fast as i can on the mobs... so why rez me midpull? Another thing... clerics seem to love during duos... when you die... they run to you and then rez you. LoL idk how many people have died doing that because the mobs were dotted and still there to turn on them x.x. But alot have. And of could i have done anyhing i would have... though that litte 'you can't attack or do anythng' green icon right afte rezzing on the buffs area prevents the last second rescue x.x.


And that concludes my rant about bijou's typical pvp and non pvp mistakes that i have found problems with :P. I hope you all have fun argueing about what's a problem and what's not... since i put a major cramp in my hands typing this much in one sitting x.x. Just for my friends in bijou.

The problem I have with what you say is, half of this crap, is um, ya kinda of retarded? Your basing all of your "pvp expertise" on the fact of the few people you "probably" fought in pvp1. I've never seen you in 70 BG except for once, and let me be honest you got it handed to you.

But I can't count myself out, I die alot to, but its mainly to fighters or a group. The only archers who I've fought and lost against were Evilstar and Flash, and dang dude you just can't compare to either of them.

I don't get why when people hit 79 they think they're good. A lvl 69 could be better then a 79, its all about strategy and what you have over the other. If the 69 cookie'd against the 79, the 69 would most likely win because he has an upper hand, unless the 79 pulls something out of his bag of tricks. See this is a concept you know nothing about because you have no strategy, you rely on brute strength to win. And no running and kiting is not a strategy.

[Farashimisanoob]

The problem I have with what you say is, half of this crap, is um, ya kinda of retarded?and dang dude you just can't compare to either of them

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s156/KoolKidsKlub93/180px-Obvioustroll.jpg

[Kealm]

The problem I have with what you say is, half of this crap, is um, ya kinda of retarded? Your basing all of your "pvp expertise" on the fact of the few people you "probably" fought in pvp1. I've never seen you in 70 BG except for once, and let me be honest you got it handed to you.

But I can't count myself out, I die alot to, but its mainly to fighters or a group. The only archers who I've fought and lost against were Evilstar and Flash, and dang dude you just can't compare to either of them.

I don't get why when people hit 79 they think they're good. A lvl 69 could be better then a 79, its all about strategy and what you have over the other. If the 69 cookie'd against the 79, the 69 would most likely win because he has an upper hand, unless the 79 pulls something out of his bag of tricks. See this is a concept you know nothing about because you have no strategy, you rely on brute strength to win. And no running and kiting is not a strategy.


I'm in bg, you just aren't there much when i am i guess. And I to have died to many an axe fighter. I believe i already stated above that i'm not the best so i don't see what your point is. And kiting itself is not a strategy, it's how i apply it that is.

I do not know evil star and am not in a physical condition to yet challenge flash, that day will come... but prob at 89 the way things are looking now. And unless you were peeping in on my dueling the monster with his axe of teva (was stones only not using pots to make up the handicap, i bleive i was testing my evasion that day)... i've yet to be 'owned' 1v1 in the way you put it. Maybe you somehow refer to the various guild wars where i have 4-5 people targetting me... in that case i don't see your point at all.

This thread is about comon errors, not about how good i am. But thanks for your reply anyways.

I can't help it looks like i'm bragging, i just can't use anything other then my own experiences when ranting, doing otherwise is just plain dumb.

[Akujiki]

you want some real tips on pvp?

fighters: watch out for max cool down on devastate
archers: those DoTs may look like small amounts of dmg but it adds up
mages: fear is not your friend
clerics: snorefest in plate armor they will bore you to death

[donkster]

you want some real tips on pvp?

fighters: watch out for max cool down on devastate
archers: those DoTs may look like small amounts of dmg but it adds up
mages: fear is not your friend
clerics: snorefest in plate armor they will bore you to death

correction

mages: stifle is not your friend

[CristoPT]

correction

mages: stifle is not your friend


ah, i can't agree more to this.

[FrostFruit]

The main problems I face in PvP are fighters. I really don't like running much because I cannot concentrate on what skills to use next. Thier HP stones recover 2000 hp from what I can recall and they have skills to lower stats and power. Sometimes the fighters miss, but it's all chance. The classes that can either be win or lose is against mages or archers. The other classes can take damage really well and can return the damage.

Some experiences I have faced in PvP are fighters becoming enraged whenever I kite and kill them. Though, my advantage is range. If they do not want us to run, then range should be taken away.

[kinsin]

this is all kinda lame..

[Ramgee]

hi zegaii. it's me lobos :)

[evold]

fear is only your friend if facing a cleric or you're about to die. anyways stifle for the win.... I dont pvp much... I just use a roumen scrolll steal some scrolls and laugh at whose t4 scrolls i stole. but myself being a mage tank.... i still get my buttox handed to me.

[RyaikenDune]

Lol zegai ^^. You won't believe the carp I get sometimes for running. But I do it anyways. And anything less than 20 levels higher than me is now fair-game ^^. A good technique for WASD users is to act like you're going to do some complex manouvre at a dead end...but then just run right through them ^^.

Yes Cherry, I'm sure you don't like running. *points to today in FBZ1 where Frost dragged 2 fighters, a cleric and a mage (shall remained unamed) through 5 ghoulish rounds of FBZ1 with poisons flying like rain @_@*


Shhhh wittle archers....shhhhh! Dex will make everything all right...yeah...YEAH! Is it just me or does deva have the accuracy of a drunken camel these days?

[kinsin]

.... no running right through them is pathetic too
when an archer starts running people usually just hit the attack button let there char follow em
ur aoe poison does NOT DO ENOUGH DMG
and when u get to the end of say fbz1 on the bottom.. like most archers do, every fighter just stops and gets ready to deva... so if u run through them, or onthe side of them, ur screwed

mages... well no point in running, just fight
clerics... definately no point in running, they can heal... just pray for crits in a row


i'll tell u what... whisper me ingame, i'll come to fbz1 and u can run from me, i garuntee it wont work on me, go get some +9 armor and put up a fight... hell scroll and cookie if u want to

[Kealm]

The main problems I face in PvP are fighters. I really don't like running much because I cannot concentrate on what skills to use next. Thier HP stones recover 2000 hp from what I can recall and they have skills to lower stats and power. Sometimes the fighters miss, but it's all chance. The classes that can either be win or lose is against mages or archers. The other classes can take damage really well and can return the damage.

Some experiences I have faced in PvP are fighters becoming enraged whenever I kite and kill them. Though, my advantage is range. If they do not want us to run, then range should be taken away.

Fighters are lazy just like the rest of us. If they dont want to work for a kill then i guess they won't get their kill. There are a few that when they put on their beastly axe, even if you mess them up they'll do enough damage to kill x.x. I haven't experienced that first hand yet outside of testing or for fun pvp gos.. i'm sure i will sooner or later. And they can get mad as they want, the tougher they are the more stubborn i'll be. No one seems to believe me when i say i'll run down every last stone if given the chance, no one has tried to find out.


hi zegaii. it's me lobos :)

LoL, hi... looks like i've been found even on the forums.


Lol zegai ^^. You won't believe the carp I get sometimes for running. But I do it anyways. And anything less than 20 levels higher than me is now fair-game ^^. A good technique for WASD users is to act like you're going to do some complex manouvre at a dead end...but then just run right through them ^^.

Yes Cherry, I'm sure you don't like running. *points to today in FBZ1 where Frost dragged 2 fighters, a cleric and a mage (shall remained unamed) through 5 ghoulish rounds of FBZ1 with poisons flying like rain @_@*


Shhhh wittle archers....shhhhh! Dex will make everything all right...yeah...YEAH! Is it just me or does deva have the accuracy of a drunken camel these days?

Oh i believe it, i've experienced my share of getting cursed and called a 'chicken' for doing it. In my opinion if there is a way to win, use it. And as i just said to cherry, if i think there's even the slightest chance of winning when i'm being serious about it, i'll go for it. Going all the way to a dead end never works, they can predict your turns then. I don't do serius pvp in fbz1... it's way to congested in there and to many times someone interupts you and tag teams ya ^^. That is especially so when they get in the way of your aoe poisons... woops my bad i'm trying to fight sorry i mad you made lol. I'm more serious in open areas where the unpredictable turning can take place. I don't run right through anyone though, there is enough time in tha sort of move for them to think on their feet. I tend to arch or zig zag as i run them in a circle. I change directions anytime i throw them off course with my random turning. Fighting a fighter is an art... it'll pay off someday.


.... no running right through them is pathetic too
when an archer starts running people usually just hit the attack button let there char follow em
ur aoe poison does NOT DO ENOUGH DMG
and when u get to the end of say fbz1 on the bottom.. like most archers do, every fighter just stops and gets ready to deva... so if u run through them, or onthe side of them, ur screwed

mages... well no point in running, just fight
clerics... definately no point in running, they can heal... just pray for crits in a row


i'll tell u what... whisper me ingame, i'll come to fbz1 and u can run from me, i garuntee it wont work on me, go get some +9 armor and put up a fight... hell scroll and cookie if u want to

fbz1 is the worst of the pvp zones for successful archer pvp, fbz3 works the best, and fbz2 is nice if you like running in straight lines. BG also is splendid for how i like to do my pvp. Don't forget i come armed to the teeth in pots, i can survive a stun for it's duration most the time. The pots are my way of making the score even against our older players who have the gear and extenders that i don't. Using resources to upgrade my pvp game, and i have plenty to spare.

[donkster]

.... no running right through them is pathetic too
when an archer starts running people usually just hit the attack button let there char follow em
ur aoe poison does NOT DO ENOUGH DMG
and when u get to the end of say fbz1 on the bottom.. like most archers do, every fighter just stops and gets ready to deva... so if u run through them, or onthe side of them, ur screwed

mages... well no point in running, just fight
clerics... definately no point in running, they can heal... just pray for crits in a row


i'll tell u what... whisper me ingame, i'll come to fbz1 and u can run from me, i garuntee it wont work on me, go get some +9 armor and put up a fight... hell scroll and cookie if u want to

Very well said sir.

[Crossface92]

my stun is empowered to 8 seconds so I stun them, then spam my skills and they usually just die.

[vonartrix]

my deva happens to have all 20 points in it. so 8 second stun 14sec CD= lots of stunzzz. Still a archer like jellac can stand up to me pretty easily (and not forgetting that i got my sorry behind handed to me, dont have to go through all that running, just get +9s, lots of em and of course END or t4 scrolls and u can last quite a while. Running makes things boring.

Forgot to mention, she was 79 and i was 68 and fully +9ed with lv60 +9 axe. So yeah, with enough hp and def archers can survive warriors (me at least :D) and provide a good fight. A fight with jus ppl running is extremely boring as the dmg only pretty much goes 1 way unless you run into a corner or the fighter is using a speed scroll

[Kealm]

Someone mentioned something about following with a simple attack option, those are the easiest to manipulate. Considering my preferred feild of battle is fbz3 there are a ton of place i can get you stuck on the map terrain for doing that. I had the enjoyment of catching someone that way i should have never beaten :P. I naturally nuked him till he gave up and let me kill him. Course he came back to kill me right away after, but he had to work for that one... and was much more fun to fight the way i like to ^^.


my deva happens to have all 20 points in it. so 8 second stun 14sec CD= lots of stunzzz. Still a archer like jellac can stand up to me pretty easily (and not forgetting that i got my sorry behind handed to me, dont have to go through all that running, just get +9s, lots of em and of course END or t4 scrolls and u can last quite a while. Running makes things boring.

Forgot to mention, she was 79 and i was 68 and fully +9ed with lv60 +9 axe. So yeah, with enough hp and def archers can survive warriors (me at least :D) and provide a good fight. A fight with jus ppl running is extremely boring as the dmg only pretty much goes 1 way unless you run into a corner or the fighter is using a speed scroll

The 20 pionts deva is what i tell myself ever fighter has. I count in my head for the stuns, taking advantage of the lapses for a random power shot to the face. And i'm not +9'd head to toe... therefore ishall run or i shall die, i chose to run.

The lvl difference makes a huge difference... i don't think i would need to run either if fighting a 6x, regardless of enancement or not. If you were cookied on top of that then you might be a threat for me to run down like normal. I don't believe i've ever run into a corner, i'm constantly rotating the camera angles. If you saw my screen you'd get dizzy. Just a warning, i keep a stack of t3 speeds on me at all times, you throw a speed scroll on... consider it wasted. I find kiting rather entertaining :P. To bad no one shares that opinion.