dirt cheep prices

[Lodos]

I don't understand why every one is undercharging on things like scrolls and elure. Most of them are only making 10 to 20c more than if they had sold the raw matirials to an npc. It's realy annoying, nobody can make much money because this started. I missed the closed beta when 70c an elure was dirt cheep. Then I was at least able to make enough money to get the next equipmen when I reached that lvl.

[Monklet]

so.... now u have to do work?


poor you...

[wangfu85]

......-_- you didnt think this over did you?


First off ppl undercharge things like scrolls and elrunes b/c they want the next level of production. Let me break it down for you, lix(1) requires 200 production points, xir(1) requires 1000 points. In order for them to produce the next level they need to meet the requirements. NOW HOW THE h*ck do you think they can produce the next level stuff if they cant sell off thier intial products cheap and fast.



Dude ..... -__- its part of the simple gaming instincts... very simple.

[Lodos]

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YOU didn't think this over verry well. First of al, if you get more money for you sells you can buy more raw matirials from players and reach the next production lvl faster. Secondly, the reduced prices in things like elure also reduces the price in the buying shops. That means the people who make money frome thoughs buying shops have less too. Its basic economics you idiot. LESS MONEY FOR EVERYONE!!!!!!!! While the cost of produced items keeps declining due to everyone undercuting compitition, the npc items will never be reduced. Also what is the point of getting your production lvl up if nobody can aford what you make due to the games econamy.

[ASCIIrider]

As one of those who'd rather get my production up fast, Yes I sell cheaper than I can too, and usually pay more when I open a shop than most.


Also if you sell cheaper you make up in volume... who are you going to buy from the person with 50c Elrue, or the one with 25c Elrue? Who's shop will sell out first?


Also, the game's been out as open beta for 5 days... takes longer than that for prices to stabelize as like was mentioned, right now people are trying to get their skills up. Near the end of CB1 vit scrolls were selling for 1s or more.... Right now it's supply vs demand and the supply far outweighs the demand.

[Felter]

This is simple to answer it's how a market works. Seller A has 100 elrue, seller B has 100 elrue, both want to sell their respective elrues for a progit and as quick as possible,*seller A was the first to put his on the market*and goes for*50c each, now seller B wants to sell his as quickly as possible, so he undercuts seller A by 5c selling his at 45c, now seller A notices that just after the first 5 sales his sales have stopped, then he notices that seller B is right next to him selling his for 45c and everyone is buying them from him. Seller B is have i raring time, his elrues are selling like hotcakes, he has already sold off half of them at 45c, making a nice little profit, not as much as if he was selling them for the 50c his neighbor is, but he has sold half his stock already and he will be able to go and make some more soon. when suddenly people stop buying from him, it's then he notices that seller C has come along and set up shop, he has 200 elrue and him not being stupid knows he has to sell them cheaper than seller A or B, so he sells them for 40c, now seller A has no choice but to*drop his price down and does so lowering his price to*35c, seller B soons follows suit by lowering his prices. This is how it happens, it's called supply and demand, right now there is more of a supply than a demand and in this game i would reckon that's how it is always going to be, for elrue,*scrolls and pots as every person can make their own. This means there will always be more*made than there is in people willing to buy, you better get used to it as you are not going to be able to make much more than a few copper at a time with any of these items. The market*eventually will be for*finished items or green items, that's the only place that you will make any real*money.***

[wangfu85]

sounds like you want to take a big piece of the players money. its not basic economy, wut your implying is monopolization. all you wanna do is to monopolize the whole community with cut throat prices. who do you think benefits from this? Only the merchants like you.


Yes your earning less, and so wut? Everything is practically affordable within your own level. OMG your earning those 10c in the beginning but have you thought that maybe in later quests you earn alot of money, so that you can buy those higher stuff? Thats the problem with your short term views. And also have you forgotten the specials drops from mobs or the KQ items. IF we went into your particular enconomics theory the whole market will be inflated with outrageous prices that no one can afford.


2ndly, yes prices are declining..... but dont blame the merchants for trying to undercut each other. PPL just want to sell their goods. BLAME the fact that the market is getting overflooded with goods. Blame the fact that production skills arent hard to get therefore not hard to make themselves. Blame it on the game system.


3rd. Market will always reach equilibrium. they always tend to find a way to reach the best possible prices in its own current state. So dont worry that the market price of tier 3 elrunes will be 999silvers forever, the prices will drop as more and more ppl reach the tier 3 production level.


4th... if you sold erlunes for 70c, you think i will buy it from you if i KNOW it will cost me less to make it myself in the long run.

[wangfu85]

sorry i edited my posts with minor grammatical errors, should be below lodos's second comment.

[wangfu85]

and i completely agree with felter + asci .


goods>demand ====> equals the current market equilibrium.

[Lodos]

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I'm going to ignore the fact that wangfu85 took everything I said out of context to the point I almost don't know who he is trying to argue with. Not to mention his misunderstanding of the word monopoly.

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Unfortunitly what felter said is true. I'm just disapointed that that is what is going to happen. Although, if this current trend continues to long, you will get more money from npcing the materials selling the produced items on the market.

[wangfu85]

Ok, I may have gone overboard to say that your actions will "monopolize" the market. Sorry about that it was totally the wrong word. I see it more as unfairly basing and determining a certain good's price, to a one from a totally different economy. If you had based it on closed beta economy it is not really fair to those who cannot or will not produce that particular good. Despite that error, I essentially believe what I have said is right, nor taken out of far proportions.

In my first paragraph I basically stated that you don’t really need to place the prices so high now. The game started up recently, the value of the economy isn’t high, NO ONE has money to buy that’s the problem (not the literal sense but you get the point). Also to clear things up a bit, the raising the price of goods so the people cannot afford them that’s called inflation. Now you can argue and debate that 70c is not expensive, but I really think that’s expensive in retrospect to everything concurrent with OB.

My second paragraph: The prices of goods are declining as you have said, due to the undercutting. I said that it’s not the fault of the people; it’s the fault of the system. Production skills are not restraint by level and because of this people just keep producing and producing until they get the next production skill. THIS is why the market is flooded. You cannot just go and amend the price because you will just be simply ignoring the inventory and current demand trend for those goods.

My third paragraph is in direct argument with one of your statements: "Also what is the point of getting your production level up if nobody can afford what you make due to the games econamy". I simply stated that the price of the goods will eventually drop when more and more people create higher level productions. It’s a Win-Win situation. Merchants are happy because they can increase their production skills, and consumers are happy because they get a bargain on higher Tier goods. Also its not like your selling at a total loss, your obliviously selling for profit but not a big profit.

I have not taken your post entirely out of context, perhaps you merely misunderstood it. I can understand since I do have the tendency to jump and skip details.
-also I would like to comment that while the market may not recover to the point of closed beta, I would like to point out that its better to sell the materials to players rather then to NPC for the reason is that people value their production skill levels.

[Felter]

Also to clear things up a bit, the raising the price of goods so the people cannot afford them that’s called inflation.

You have this wrong the meaning of the word "INFLATION" (according to the dictionary) is "a general, continuous increase in prices" what you mean is called "over pricing".

Also you can't compare the market now, with the market in closed beta, as the market in closed beta was a closed market, with a limited amount of buyers and sellers that knew, it didn't really matter what the paying or selling price was, as in the end it was all going to be taken away from them.

[kindreddreamer]

Fiesta makes it very easy to produce goods (at least at a low lvl) which is fair IMHO, simplicity at the early levels helps ease you into a crafting/leveling/profession system and with the sheer increase in players since the game has gone open beta more and more people are collecting the goods to make these low level items lets face it its not hard to get a few dusts and leathers to make a few scrolls etc. This happens in a lot of MMO's that leave the crafting system in the players. it will also move in waves after a few weeks/months all the new players will have moved to the next grinding areas and will have got there skills up and your see that band of production items become cheep as more and more players learn to craft those items in that bracket. it will level out as less people crowding the n00b areas/people quit/ higher end players not bothering to grind the low level crafting items. i realyl don't see why this such a suprise to some people.

If i want to waste a few copper on cheap items to save me grinding for the Mats. myself why not the person gets some coin and I get a cheap item. As has previously been stated why the hell would I want to spend 40c on somethign when i could spend 30c!

well thats my 2c on the issue anyway :)

[phantasie101]

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YOU didn't think this over verry well. First of al, if you get more money for you sells you can buy more raw matirials from players and reach the next production lvl faster. Secondly, the reduced prices in things like elure also reduces the price in the buying shops. That means the people who make money frome thoughs buying shops have less too. Its basic economics you idiot. LESS MONEY FOR EVERYONE!!!!!!!! While the cost of produced items keeps declining due to everyone undercuting compitition, the npc items will never be reduced. Also what is the point of getting your production lvl up if nobody can aford what you make due to the games econamy.

YOU didnt think over your first sentence. if ppl r sellin things for higher prices, then wen u sell ur elrues for a high price, even though ull hav more money, the raw mats will also cost more, meaning gettting just about the exact same amount as b4. also, think about this, this is open beta, just about everyone in the game started a few days ago, not many ppl will have the money to buy things that hav a high price, so dont whine about not getting money, theres plenty of games out there where money is hard to get, but thats the point of the game, u gotta WORK for it.

[Son_of_liberty]

Welcome to the world of MMORPGs get used to impatient people undercutting prices because "I want my munnies nowzors lolroflcopterqbbq***lul". You can say all your basic economics stuff but it all boils down to the impatience of the other people.

[Munchy]

Another point that seems to have been overlooked is that at the moment the whole economy is based on buying and selling stuff that is easy to make and therefore commonly available to everyone. In all MMOs that I have played it is the rare/hard to make stuff that is what you make any real money on.

My feeling is that as the game/economy develops there will be more ways become available to earn money and things will settle down. But no-one is going to get rich from selling tier 1 pots/scrolls/elrues etc. :p

[Ghostdogg]

My only question is is why elrue is cheaper then higher level stones? In most games that you buff your weapons in, the first level stones are more exspensive. The reason being is that most people only buff their weapons to +3 or +4, not wanting to risk breaking them. Also you need to get them to +4 before you can buy the next level stones anyhoo. I played CB for 9dragons and it was like that off the get go. Just my thought, I prsonally LOVE the low prices, heh, but now I make my own stones..... :)

[Tamlinari]

I need to get some production skills but I haven't really bothered because elru and lix are so inexpensive but the down side of it for everyone is as the price of the stones go down so does the price for the raw materials.
I have to admit that I shop for the cheapest price because I am not a very lucky enhancer and I can often find elru for as low as 20c.
The problem is that no one will pay anything for the dust either so I often have to sell dust for 5c and even then it is not easy.
Purchase stores are only offering to buy dust for 2c and sometimes not even that much.
The real down side to the price competition war is that it makes it very difficult to buy items from the fiesta merchants because they are not competitive.
A skill or armor or any other item from them is still going to cost the same and that is where it really hurts everyone.
But I can't offer any suggestion how to fix the the problem if it even can be fixed.
Just my opinion.
:D

[Deedolith]

Unfortunatly, in games, where cash is virtually unlimited, prices are bound to go down. Not like in RL.

[Gondie]

Let me sum this up for you all....

If the prices on stones/pots/scrolls drop so do the materials used to produce them. In that same sense eventually and virtually all item prices are dropped to make a quick buck. So everything is being bought/sold for cheaper.

Now, Lets take a moment to think about this.

Stones/pots/scrolls/etc are sold for a price. The materials are sold at a small fraction of this price. If you were to raise the prices for stones/pots/scrolls/etc, The prices for the materials to create them would raise as well. Thus, Everything raises due to the economy rise.

Now, We have raised prices. You would say "No one can afford this stuff" but they Can! If you sell the items made from the materials higher you Can sell your materials themselves higher. That means more profit for those selling the materials. The players that buy the materials to make the stones/pots/scrolls/etc end up making more money as well by selling the stones/pots/scrolls/etc that they make.

Everything is evenly spaced out (fairly well, anyways) from the price of the item(s) made from the materials. Why dont we help out our own community by raising our prices by a little bit instead of bringing the game into a state of economic depression?

People say "Dont blame the players, Blame the system!", To hell with you! The system is perfectly fine, Its the greedy people that are bringing down the economy.

Enough ranting and raving from me, People just keep turning the equation around to make it look bad, When you can do the opposite and Everyone prospers from it!

[TastyTapioca]

I tend to view the market like I did pets in CB2.

They were expensive when not many were around. As time went on and people got them from event drops, the prices went down. If people see someone selling a pet for 10s and they have enough that they can sell theirs for 8s, that's their own decision and no one elses. Why keep things in high prices? The newbie stuff is going to reduce in price eventually anyways as anyone can make it. The real money is in the higher level items (T2 creations, armor, etc).

[wangfu85]

Uhm... Gondie, hate to break this to you, but the whole topic was orginally on the price of Erules [1], how the price was undersold at the TIME OF TOPIC (about a week from open beta). Dont tell me ppl had money cuz at the time of the post i had less than 3s, and you usually dont get money unless your A DAM GOLD FARMER. OBLIVIOUSLY PPL WILL HAVE MONEY NOW, BUT NOT AT THE START OF THE OPEN BETA. If really you think the overpriced good are fair, ill sell you on elrunes [1] for 70c; How about that, are you gonna buy?

Furthermore your statement on PPL greed is quite naive. You obliviously don't understand that this world that you living in revolves around money. PPL LOVE MONEY, PPL EVEN SELL THEMSELVES EVERYDAY FOR MONEY. If you gonna say that ppl are dam greedy, then go live in the antarctica and start your own greed free colony.

Geesh, why do you look at things one dimensionally?